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Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

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Re: Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

#181
post #30

I'm assuming some HNers are soon to arrive saying things like "why does it matter that a founder is a female?", "why make an excluding event? isn't it sexism all the same", "imagine if someone make a 'male founders conference'?" I would like to ask you to think for a moment, before raising this concerns (I am not bothering here to debate with haters, only with those who are genuinely concerned that this might sexism…

I'm assuming some HNers are soon to arrive saying things like "why does it matter that a founder is a black person?", "why make an excluding event? isn't racism all the same", "imagine if someone made a 'white founders conference'?"

I would like to ask you to think for a moment, before raising these concerns (I am not bothering here to debate with haters, only with those who are genuinely concerned that this might be racism, all the same).

If a group is underrepresented in some professional, economical, academical field, it is worthy to understand the causes. Sometimes is a historical gap in fields that have a self-perpetuating cycle of dominance (such as women in politics). It is tough to address such underrepresentation, and it take generations to make any change (as it took generations and generations to create the initial gap).

This is not the case for black founders. Here we have a much simples issue: stigmatization. At least, this is how most people in this field, including the organizers of this event, seems to classify it. It is easier to address because a cultural perception is easier to change than institutionalized cycles of power (as in politics).

And, as I see it, this is the only goal of this event. No one is claiming that blacks are better than whites or asians in founding startups. Or the opposite, that blacks are worse than whites in founding startups and that they need special treatment. This event is only trying inspire blacks, and that founding startups shouldn't be stigmatized as a white and asian club. Blacks can have a good life in founding one if they give this thought a chance.

So there the only assumptions I see in this event are that: (i) founding a startup is a good thing that they should inspire people to do (something largely supported by HN audience I would guess) and (ii) that blacks aren't currently being correctly or ideally presented, attracted and inspired to these opportunities of founding a startup.

These two assumptions may be contested. If you disagree with assumption (i) you a have a much bigger fight to pick, basically the whole illusion that Sillicon Valley sells to the world, this event isn't particular relevant in this broader debate.

And if you disagree with assumption (ii), that this event is not necessary, it means that is no harm done by such an event occurring. It would by useless at most, but not particularly harmful.

This is my perception of this, and I am writing it hoping to avoid a thread full of heated debate based on false assumptions. Maybe I am being pretentious, but I swear I am just trying to help and expose my thoughts on the subject.

Re: Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

#182
post #30

I'm assuming some HNers are soon to arrive saying things like "why does it matter that a founder is a female?", "why make an excluding event? isn't it sexism all the same", "imagine if someone make a 'male founders conference'?" I would like to ask you to think for a moment, before raising this concerns (I am not bothering here to debate with haters, only with those who are genuinely concerned that this might sexism…

Thanks for the comment. Sorry your hope at the bottom of your post is a pipe dream :)

I am a woman. I am thinking of being a founder. I guess I'm a founder of something since I'm working on selling products (ebooks) online. (Huh. A realization.) I am totally interested in this Female Founders conference because I might see people "like me" who have succeeded. How exciting to learn from them what worked!

Some guy will read that paragraph and tell me I should just learn from guys. I already do -- I read HN, pg's stuff, books on iOS, tutorials on python, lifehacker stuff, coding stuff, math stuff. I learn from guys all the time about many important things.

But not one of these guys is going to show me by example how a short woman can come across as authoritative but not (too) bitchy or how a woman can negotiate for VC funding effectively without bringing a guy along or how a woman can manage a public or pseudonymous online identity through the shoals of denigrating emails or sexually explicit snarking.

I want to see how women do it, because that's what I'm going to have to do.

Re: Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

#183
post #157
post #30

I'm assuming some HNers are soon to arrive saying things like "why does it matter that a founder is a female?", "why make an excluding event? isn't it sexism all the same", "imagine if someone make a 'male founders conference'?" I would like to ask you to think for a moment, before raising this concerns (I am not bothering here to debate with haters, only with those who are genuinely concerned that this might sexism…

HN readers in these gender discussions are so outright condescending, hateful, and knowingly, deliberately unreasonable-- not to mention "othering"-- it makes me consider never coming to this website ever again. Thank you for being a voice of reason, even though doing so can be incredibly frustrating in its fruitlessness sometimes.

Please stay. Don't let the vocal minority dissuade you. There are a good number of people here that do care. Gender is being increasingly discussed here now, which inevitably draws out this discussion.

I really think that this site will become more inclusive, but it needs your voice (and your votes).

Re: Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

#184
post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what you're saying is, you won't read either essay.

What I'm saying is explicitly written down in the posts I've made. If you're willing to engage the points I'm actually making, I'll have a discussion with you. If you're just going to throw broad-reaching polemical feminism 101 articles at very specific points, I'm not going to take you seriously. You didn't even state why you think those articles apply to the (again, very specific ) point I made.

I thought it would be obvious by just reading the articles. Even in environments where there are a bit more women than men, men still have male privilege (as McIntosh describes it), women are still under oppression (as Frye describes it). Women still fear rape and all other male violence on college campuses, for example. "Majority" makes no difference when it comes to power structures; look at "the 1%" in the US..

Re: Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

#185
post #178
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems you need a bit more than dclowd9901. Perhaps "White Privilege and Male Privilege" by Peggy McIntosh and "Oppression" by Marilyn Frye are good places to start: http://www.iub.edu/~tchsotl/part2/McIntosh%20White%20Privile... http://www.calstatela.edu/faculty/tbettch/Frye,%20Oppression...

Just looked at the former, and it starts with an example of zero-sum thinking -- namely, that someone's disadvantage is necessarily a source of an advantage for others. Other social justice concepts are apparently also derived from this logical fallacy. I love feminism btw; it has been, and still is, a truly progressive movement, despite it being currently infested with SJW's. The fundamental difference, which result…

"are we pulling women up (the conference in question being a great example of that), or are we dragging everyone else down"

"everyone else" happens to be men, and plenty of self-identified feminists believe that men need to have power and privilege taken from them, because no one should have the kind of power we do, by nature of the gender caste system. I recommend the first essay, first. "feminism" isn't a monolithic "movement," it's kind of like saying "I love conservatism!"

Re: Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

#186
post #18

I'm against these, because I'm against gender discrimination. Gender discrimination means that one gender is treated differently from another. It's also interesting to know whether transwomen will be allowed. Some radical feminists only accept 'born as women' to their conferences. And if transwomen are accepted, what's their definition of that.

jeez what's with all of these MRAs coming out everywhere when somebody tries to do something for women? this shit happens every single time

What's with people wanting to dismiss opinions they don't like with poorly thought out strawmen?

Re: Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

#187
post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

jeez what's with all of these MRAs coming out everywhere when somebody tries to do something for women? this shit happens every single time

Men always become very nervous when women try to have their own spaces, talk amongst themselves, organize into groups, etc. It's like reality can't pass the Bechdel Test.

Some men!

Re: Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

#188
post #187
post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Men always become very nervous when women try to have their own spaces, talk amongst themselves, organize into groups, etc. It's like reality can't pass the Bechdel Test.

Some men!

More like "men as a political class." I'm male, and I knew I was inviting this comment. To me saying "some men" is like giving the "good men" a cookie, when really all men should be concerned about these kinds of things, by virtue of being human.

Re: Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

#189
post #182
post #30

I'm assuming some HNers are soon to arrive saying things like "why does it matter that a founder is a female?", "why make an excluding event? isn't it sexism all the same", "imagine if someone make a 'male founders conference'?" I would like to ask you to think for a moment, before raising this concerns (I am not bothering here to debate with haters, only with those who are genuinely concerned that this might sexism…

Thanks for the comment. Sorry your hope at the bottom of your post is a pipe dream :) I am a woman. I am thinking of being a founder. I guess I'm a founder of something since I'm working on selling products (ebooks) online. (Huh. A realization.) I am totally interested in this Female Founders conference because I might see people "like me" who have succeeded. How exciting to learn from them what worked! Some guy will…

Curious to know what you think of BGC (and others like it)?

http://blackgirlscode.org/

Re: Announcing the Female Founders Conference (March 1)

#190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is no such case for female founders. Here we have a much simples issue: stigmatization. I disagree. I might be in the minority but in the places I've worked in tech no one cares - at least as far as I can tell - what your gender is, it's how well you do the job. What I do see a lot of is women who are capable but not interested in STEM. Not because of some kind of social stigma, they just don't care about it.…

Would you be willing to do me a favor and take the implicit association test on gender at https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit and post back the results? I really think that it's the best answer I can give to someone like you who would want a bit of deeper understanding into what this is all about ...

"Your data suggest little or no association between Female and Male with Science and Liberal Arts."

I tried the Gender-Career one and got the same result.

I guess i'm abnormal?

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