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How to terminate your worst enemy's Dropbox account for only $795

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Re: How to terminate your worst enemy's Dropbox account for only $795

#181
post #107

Another Dropbox horror story: My colleague lost most of his Dropbox folder last week, and wasn't able to recover everything. What happened: he had Dropbox synced to 2 computers, but one of them hadn't been used in a while. He turned on the old computer, and apparently, for some reason, Dropbox decided that the fact that many files weren't there was because they were deleted. Of course, the files weren't there because…

Down-voted because I think that it is just dumb to have a Dropbox account and forgo local backup of the files on the service. Dropbox is not an extension of your mission-critical local storage and backup. My approach for Dropbox on both Windows and OSX is to have the Dropbox folder on a drive that will never see development work, even if that means creating a separate partition for it. In most cases the system drive…

Lots of people use Dropbox just like this, without local backups. For many people I know, that's part of the point - versioning helps, too.

It's certainly neither 'dumb' and nor is mentioning a friend who did this down-vote worthy.

Re: How to terminate your worst enemy's Dropbox account for only $795

#183
post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering huge number of users will never use the Teams folder, it seems like an additional click for no good reason for most users.

Only display the teams folder if the user is a member of one or more teams... easy fix.

Let's say I start with a Personal account. I use it for a few weeks. In this time, you are saying there won't be a Personal folder, right? So in a few weeks I am added to a Team. The Teams and Personal folders appear. Does this mean all the file paths for files inside my Personal folder change to /Personal/?

Re: How to terminate your worst enemy's Dropbox account for only $795

#184
post #133

Hey guys - Dropbox product manager here, tl;dr: The scenario described by the OP is now less likely to occur. Since October, individual Dropbox users are encouraged to create separate accounts when invited to a Team and warned that Teams admins will have control over the account. We want individual and Team Dropbox users to have the best possible experience. Some users want to migrate their personal accounts into a T…

Hey, OP here - First of all, in Dropbox's defense, I probably did not give you guys enough time to respond before going public with this (also, living in Israel I sometimes forget that Sunday is a weekend for most people in the world). I apologize for that. I am not a journalist/blogger, and I was driven more by my emotions than by "journalistic ethics" (?) when submitting to HN. Second, according to your support ema…

When migrating an account into a team, the account and all the data in the account becomes managed by the Teams admin (shared or otherwise). Letting an existing account to join a team lets us smoothly support the situation where a user has created a Dropbox account separately and needs to move that account into the team.

For most cases though, users should create a new account for the team. The Dropbox for Teams sign up process guides users towards creating a new account when joining a team for this reason.

Re: How to terminate your worst enemy's Dropbox account for only $795

#185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Down-voted because I think that it is just dumb to have a Dropbox account and forgo local backup of the files on the service. Dropbox is not an extension of your mission-critical local storage and backup. My approach for Dropbox on both Windows and OSX is to have the Dropbox folder on a drive that will never see development work, even if that means creating a separate partition for it. In most cases the system drive…

>At best this is an unfortunate "pilot error" It is in no way "pilot error". If the post you replied to is correct, the dropbox software performed an action it should never perform - deleting files the user did not tell the OS to delete. What's more, every dropbox plan I'm aware of keeps deleted files for 30 days, so if it wasn't possible to recover some of the files, dropbox failed not once but twice. It's all very…

The "pilot error" is in not testing the solution before trusting it and in making an assumption that the data would be safe in an untested external system.

Let me put it into a financial context. I did a project that added up to some $800K in cost. Two developers over about a year. Do you think that for even a microsecond I would trust Dropbox as a backup mechanism without extensive qualification and testing? And, would I have that as my sole approach to backup?

Nope.

And this isn't me coming down on Dropbox or suggesting that they are unreliable. I use Dropbox and I am very happy with the service. However, based on experience gotten the hard way, I do not use it for anything that is mission critical. The important stuff is backed-up locally, sometimes with redundant backups.

I don't have any sympathy for an engineer who uses a service and relies on it without the proper testing and qualification phase. Behaving that way is most-definitely, as I said, to be kind, "pilot error".

It is completely unfair to blame Dropbox for anything. This is like the idea of cutting-and-pasting code from the Internet and trusting it with a mission-critical aspect of your application without dissecting the code, testing it and fully qualifying it for what it is you need it to do.

There are tons of examples of this behavior, perhaps the most common one in the web development community is email validity verification. How many careless developers copy a regex like this to validate their email and don't think twice about it:

    ^[a-zA-Z0-9_.+-]+@[a-zA-Z0-9-]+\.[a-zA-Z0-9-.]+$
These things are all over the web. And most of them suck. Even some of the most impressive ones will lead you astray.

How many engineers (and, as a result, websites) fail to test and research and end-up with questionable solutions?

Would you blame the regex writer for this or the engineer who chose to use it without doing any testing at all?

It doesn't matter what the regex author claims or how authoritative the website featuring the regex might be, you have to test it before deploying it! If you don't test, deploy and then loose customers because it is a bad regex it is YOUR fault, not the author's. Blaming them is nonsensical.

In case you are curious, here's "the" solution: http://isemail.info/about

Not only is it well documented, the author offers test vectors and all of the relevant code and references so that you can take the time to qualify the solution.

So, yes, to be redundant, if an engineer does not do his job I am perfectly happy calling it "pilot error" and even going as far as calling it "incompetence".

Re: How to terminate your worst enemy's Dropbox account for only $795

#187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely you need to test your restores, regularly! I used to use Mozy but when I tried a trial restore it was taking forever and missing some files. Also it inserts these .PART files into your system that can almost double the size of the folders you're trying to back up. I looked at backblaze but it doesn't work with server computers. So I'm now trying crashplan. I'm really interested in the feature of crashplan…

One trouble with testing restores is that my likely avenue in the event of a real catastrophic failure that required a real restore would be to have them send me the data on a hard disk, to the tune of about $200. Not something I want to try just to make sure it works. I could try a download restore, but this would entail downloading a couple hundred GB of data, and wouldn't really exercise the same path I'd use in a…

Any thoughts on the right way to approach it?

No, that's a tough one, especially with a back up the size you're doing.

Everytime you do a restore that's just confirmation that a particular backup was/was not sound.

Wouldn't it be neat if the back up program had functionality that allowed you to restore a random sample of your files ( and maybe then compare these to the originals ) and give you a likelihood that your entire backup is sound? A sort of sampling quality control process.

Re: How to terminate your worst enemy's Dropbox account for only $795

#189
post #107

Another Dropbox horror story: My colleague lost most of his Dropbox folder last week, and wasn't able to recover everything. What happened: he had Dropbox synced to 2 computers, but one of them hadn't been used in a while. He turned on the old computer, and apparently, for some reason, Dropbox decided that the fact that many files weren't there was because they were deleted. Of course, the files weren't there because…

Is it possible that the unused machine has the wrong date? Perhaps that confused the operative system file dates and Dropbox. (I have an old machine that hardly use now that has problems with the motherboard battery and sometime it travels in time to a funny date like 2000 and all the security certificates are marked as wrong.)

You'd think Dropbox on each computer would check the last time it had synced, using the time reported from a Dropbox server.

I pray they wouldn't ever rely on users' own system clocks.

Re: How to terminate your worst enemy's Dropbox account for only $795

#190

Hey guys - Dropbox product manager here, tl;dr: The scenario described by the OP is now less likely to occur. Since October, individual Dropbox users are encouraged to create separate accounts when invited to a Team and warned that Teams admins will have control over the account. We want individual and Team Dropbox users to have the best possible experience. Some users want to migrate their personal accounts into a T…

* Teams admins want better control of data within a Team, and users want easy access to their personal stuff, but it’s not possible for us to differentiate between Team data and personal stuff in the same account.*

Of course it's possible. You just don't want to put the work in it make it happen.

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