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A big win for Android interoperability

openhomefoundation.org

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Re: A big win for Android interoperability

#181

Post by ddeeo »

kelnos wrote: post #124
wltr wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it’s not, all of my and my extended family cards (for… like a decade!) are never even leave the envelope they come in. I’m not sure I personally know people who use physical cards over Google or Apple Pay. I have seen the cards being used in the wild, of course. But I’m having hard time remembering anyone I personally know who does that.

> I’m not sure I personally know people who use physical cards over Google or Apple Pay. You live in a pretty weird bubble. (And I live in San Francisco, so I know about weird bubbles.)

Like half of the UK adult population use them: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2ejvld0ypyo

That's from a year ago, I'm sure it's only grown since.

I think it's you who's in a bubble, my friend.

Re: A big win for Android interoperability

#182

Post by inigyou »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #171
inigyou wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. It makes sense for well-regulated remote attestation. But is that what we actually want or do we want to destroy the concept altogether?

Exactly. There is no actual value provided by attestation that banks actually need. Banks have websites that work in web browsers , and those typically provide 99% of the functionality of the app, and yet the app demands attestation.

Actually the new thing is that you need to verify your login with the app before you can log in to the website on a laptop.

Re: A big win for Android interoperability

#183

Post by inigyou »

ddeeo wrote: post #179
inigyou wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How strange that culture is so different in different places. You can just start using them, though. Literally just swipe your card whenever you would swipe your phone. Do you guys not have wallets with card slots?

I've never had a physical wallet period. I'm not some Gen alpha baby either, I'm almost 30. I have like 4 bank accounts too.

Go buy one and put your cards in it

Re: A big win for Android interoperability

#184

Post by inigyou »

notpushkin wrote: post #166
inigyou wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many EU online shops accept SEPA payment. It isn't convenient, because it's a push payment (giro) which means the site can't stick it in the middle of the order flow and expect it to take a few seconds. Some users might have to visit a bank branch to send payment.

Not all banks do SEPA Instant, yeah. I suppose the answer to that is connecting using PSD2 and sending the payment request then checking payment actually went out (using something like https://gocardless.com/ ). Many countries also have local bank link systems (e.g. in the Baltics it’s common to have dedicated buttons in the payment form for the big 3 or 4 banks everyone uses). I’m talking about in-person payments th…

One problem with SEPA Instant is that it can sometimes fall back to regular SEPA which takes a few business days.

Re: A big win for Android interoperability

#185

Post by stkdump »

inigyou wrote: post #59
stkdump wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole GrapheneOS thing is a bit of a joke. So you either have to buy google hardware or you run google software. Anyway, looking forward to the widespread introduction of Wero. Maybe there will be some options for third party roms in the name of digital soveranity. Seems like they want to make the EUDI wallet for digital documents no-google capable for that reason at least.

You think Google puts backdoors in their hardware? They've consistently been one of the most open hardware brands since the start, always allowing bootloader unlocking and relocking and providing all required open source code. This is not the same as their software which is invasive spyware.

No, I don't know if they do and honestly this isn't why I wrote what I wrote. But what if I don't want to buy anything from them? I want to de-google and my only choice seems to be to have a device with a google logo on it that puts even more money in their pocket than if I just use normal Android with minimal google interaction on a Samsung or OnePlus device.

Re: A big win for Android interoperability

#186

Post by InsideOutSanta »

aatd86 wrote: post #167
InsideOutSanta wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You started arguing about it: > I said bootleg Android didnt I? And you're still doing it. Just let it go. It doesn't matter, your argument is wrong either way. Also, please stop insulting me.

You are just not making any sense. Your very first comment is the one taking offense with the word 'bootleg' erroneously... If your worry is about phone-home, no need to mention Android specifically. This happens with all off the shelf phones. Point is about a phone that has an OS that looks like what you would expect and just doesn't do what you expect. Obviously you didn't understand what I had written so I had to…

> You are just not making any sense. Your very first comment is the one taking offense with the word 'bootleg' erroneously...

No, my first comment is this:

> Everyone who buys an Android phone. This is about the opposite, an option to buy a phone that does not do that.

It doesn't say anything about "bootleg."

> Obviously you didn't understand what I had written so I had to call you on that

Again, please stop insulting me.

> You may feel insulted, does not mean that I am insulting you.

Look, I want to give you the benefit of the doubt, but it's really difficult. Do you genuinely not understand that the following things you said are insulting?

"So pedantic, you must be fun at parties."

"you are being overly pedantic while being wrong at the same time. You might find this difficult to accept but I'm just calling it."

I do understand that some people lack social awareness and therefore don't understand when they are being insulting, so it's possible that you genuinely do not realize how you come across. I am telling you now, though, that saying things like these is, in fact, insulting, regardless of your intent. So if you genuinely did not intend to insult me, I hope you will now stop writing stuff like that.

Re: A big win for Android interoperability

#187

Post by ranger_danger »

code-blooded wrote: post #126
shiandow wrote: post #22

I don't care about any of these, I just want to be able to have whatever Google pay does without Google. You could claim that's not an android problem but if you do I don't think you've ever had to explain to people your phone doesn't have a Google Play store.

Walt https://walt.is/ is building exactly that in Europe. They claim first tap to pay will happen later this year. Some European banks including mine offer NFC payments via their app as well. You don't need Google services.

Unfortunately NFC payments via bank app is not a thing in the US to my knowledge, and I've not heard of any plans to start doing it, but good for Europe.

Re: A big win for Android interoperability

#188

Post by ranger_danger »

jeroenhd wrote: post #94
aboardRat4 wrote: post #11

This is all smoke and mirrors. The core issue is not "Google not allowing a feature", it's that small businesses cannot buy phones, install a patched version of Android without a restriction and sell them to make money. Until this problem is solved, everything else is palliative.

The thing is: Google is one of the few Android phone vendors that makes doing so possible at all. Samsung, Nokia, Xiaomi, Oppo, and all the others lock their bootloaders and provide no way to relock them with your own key once you've managed to break them. Google is one of the few (if not only) vendor that actually designs their hardware to permit this. That's how GrapheneOS has blossomed. When it comes to running pa…

This is one good thing about all the crazy Linux exploits lately... you can now actually root many locked-down phones.

Re: A big win for Android interoperability

#189

Post by askonomm »

giantg2 wrote: post #51
askonomm wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is? I haven’t carried my wallet around in years, because Apple Wallet does everything I need. Concert tickets, boarding passes, bank cards, public transport cards, etc. A physical wallet and cards in comparison feels like stone age technology.

Don't you still have to carry cards for things that aren't digitally excepted, such as a drivers license in most states?

I'm not an American. In Estonia your ID is entirely digital, and I just show my e-Estonia government provided app to a scanner, which can scan my ID from there and verify it. Same with a drivers license. As long as I travel within EU I also don't need to carry a passport with me as a EU citizen.

Re: A big win for Android interoperability

#190

Post by askonomm »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #67
askonomm wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is? I haven’t carried my wallet around in years, because Apple Wallet does everything I need. Concert tickets, boarding passes, bank cards, public transport cards, etc. A physical wallet and cards in comparison feels like stone age technology.

And your battery goes empty, and you just lost everything. Or your phone falls to the ground and breaks. And to add to payments, the store loyalty apps are the worst... Lidl over here has an app only (no physical loyalty card), and they should be hanged for developing that... first of all, you're waiting in line while a grandma takes her phone out of her purse, then unlock it, and of course android is not satisfied w…

I also have Apple Wallet on my Apple Watch. I can use the Apple Watch to also pay for things.
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