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Networking changes coming in macOS 27

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Re: Networking changes coming in macOS 27

#181

Post by still_grokking »

ndisn wrote: post #64

On an unrelated note, I use Time Machine and I’m surprised at how unpolished, not to say downright buggy, all the animations are. They used to look magical, but now they are a mess of elements popping on and off and things moving and then vanishing the next frame and so on. It looks like they kept changing Finder and Time Machine didn’t keep up; they kept fixing the bare minimum to have it compile and nothing more.

The "quality" Apple delivers is by now a complete joke. It's going south since over a decade, and this never stopped.

It's like that because people are still buying. Even for the ridiculous prices Apple asks for.

So why would Apple actually care? They get away with this "quality", so from a business standpoint there is simply nothing that needs investments or even just attention.

It's a race to the bottom. Like everywhere else. That's simply how the system which people created works.

Re: Networking changes coming in macOS 27

#182

Post by still_grokking »

miki123211 wrote: post #141
joe_mamba wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>How this possible in 2026? Enshittification. When you're an ecosystem monopoly, people are forced to buy your shit no matter how bad it gets.

Macs are nowhere near a monopoly. I would (grudgingly) accept this argument for iOS, but for Mac OS it doesn't make any sense.

If you want to keep your shiny Apple stuff you're effectively trapped. Their walled garden approach works extremely well…

Re: Networking changes coming in macOS 27

#183

Post by fragmede »

riffic wrote: post #76
Melatonic wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SMB1 has major security issues but even those ignored (which a lot of people on private home networks shouldn't be too worried about) it's also slow as hell on MacOS

> people on private home networks shouldn't be too worried about philosophically I would beg to differ about any premise assuming we can trust the castle and moat model. Even on home networks.

philosophically, it depends on who you are. If you're Sam Altman or Vitalik Buterin, yeah, your private home network should be considered to be under attack by hostiles trying to steal from you, but for the rest of us, the NSA isn't going to make an international incident trying to get at your Plex server.

Re: Networking changes coming in macOS 27

#184

Post by distalx »

enaaem wrote: post #112
ndisn wrote: post #64

On an unrelated note, I use Time Machine and I’m surprised at how unpolished, not to say downright buggy, all the animations are. They used to look magical, but now they are a mess of elements popping on and off and things moving and then vanishing the next frame and so on. It looks like they kept changing Finder and Time Machine didn’t keep up; they kept fixing the bare minimum to have it compile and nothing more.

Even the new app launcher. It takes 1-2 seconds to draw a bunch of icons. Scrolling is also choppy. This even happens on their newest machines. How this possible in 2026?

We put a supercomputer in a laptop just so the OS could struggle to draw a grid of icons. Peak modern engineering.

Re: Networking changes coming in macOS 27

#185

Post by wging »

red_admiral wrote: post #99

> will require connections to certain servers to be made using at least TLS 1.2 Seriously, no-one should still be using 1.1 since ... 5 years ago? It's not even the 1.2 -> 1.3 previous upgrade problems we're talking about.

Longer than that, even. A similar requirement for iOS apps was in the cards 10 years ago. https://developer.apple.com/news/?id=12212016b

(Yes, this article is about an extension of the deadline. I don't remember what happened after that.)

Re: Networking changes coming in macOS 27

#186

Post by linguae »

joe_mamba wrote: post #132
enaaem wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even the new app launcher. It takes 1-2 seconds to draw a bunch of icons. Scrolling is also choppy. This even happens on their newest machines. How this possible in 2026?

>How this possible in 2026? Enshittification. When you're an ecosystem monopoly, people are forced to buy your shit no matter how bad it gets.

The Mac isn’t a monopoly, but choices for desktop operating systems are indeed limited. I use macOS, Windows, and Linux on a regular basis. The only one that’s improving is the Linux ecosystem. I prefer macOS to Windows, but macOS is not as polished in 2026 as it was in 2016 or especially in the Snow Leopard era.

Re: Networking changes coming in macOS 27

#187

Post by jballanc »

ninkendo wrote: post #169
wazoox wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah but AFP is still performing way better than SMB on Mac for any fast networking. Like 10GigE and faster. Apple SMB stack is a disaster, and thoroughly unprofessional. NFS is faster, too, but unfortunately the Finder, being the rat nest of bugs it is, has often trouble with NFS shares.

macOS 26 still has a hard kernel panic if you try to mount an NFS share with krb5 auth but don’t have a valid Kerberos ticket. 100% reproducible. Every OS update I try mounting with no ticket, get a panic, fill in the error reporting dialog with a nice “hope you had a nice holiday break!” message or whatever is seasonally appropriate, with the same simple steps to reproduce. It’s just kinda comical at this point. My…

It's been a while since I worked at Apple, but back in the day the entire OS X Server team made extensive use of kerberized NFS shares for moving around large files...

...the last version of Server shipped in 2021 (and the last real version shipped almost a decade before that).

Re: Networking changes coming in macOS 27

#188

Post by coldtea »

still_grokking wrote: post #182
miki123211 wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Macs are nowhere near a monopoly. I would (grudgingly) accept this argument for iOS, but for Mac OS it doesn't make any sense.

If you want to keep your shiny Apple stuff you're effectively trapped. Their walled garden approach works extremely well…

What "walled garden"? The Mac-only apps aside, what's that that you couldn't get on Windows (and most even on Linux), either the same thing, or a zero-switch-cost subscription (it's not like you need to rebuy something to go from Music to Spotify for exampe).

iCloud? You can use Google Drive or Dropbox or whatever MS calls theirs. Apple Music? Pretty sure it plays at both.

Most major apps are cross platform (Adobe, Microsoft and such), or Electron based.

Syncing with your iPhone? You can do that from Windows and Linux as well. Airpods? Work with Android and Windows too.

And so on.

Re: Networking changes coming in macOS 27

#189

Post by runlevel1 »

throw0101c wrote: post #13

Time Capsule has been unsupported since 2018 (last shipped 2013): * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AirPort_Time_Capsule I think there's some population of folks that have been doing NAS TM backups over AFP, and they'll now have to switch to SMB.

I still use AFP on my NAS for a few reasons:

1. When I benchmarked it, AFP was significantly faster than SMB. Both with SMB2 and SMB3. Even when transport encryption was turned off.

2. On SMB2+, symlinks created by the client are not real symlinks. They're "Minshall+French" links which only look like symlinks to other SMB2+ clients. To the server and NFS mounts they look like flat files with the target path encoded in them.

3. It exposes a different precision for certain timestamps. Software that uses this metadata to decide whether a file needs to be updated will see almost every file as needing a resync.

It's been a year or two since I checked the status of these. The situation may have improved since last I looked.

Re: Networking changes coming in macOS 27

#190

Post by fragmede »

post-it wrote: post #159
pmontra wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could sell a separate service for Time Machine backups. I'm not an Apple customers so I don't know if it makes sense, but they could make customers pay X times the last N days in the backup plus Y times a number M of snapshots in the past.

I wouldn't pay for it, so that's one data point.

I would, so that's a second data point.
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