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How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

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Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#181

Post by tw04 »

JonChesterfield wrote: post #145

If you can get a megawatt into the car batteries without setting them on fire, that's game over for petrol cars. And for the other electric vehicles that haven't worked it out yet. Only reason I'm on petrol is unwillingness to wait an hour to recharge the car. The rest of the infra is fine if that can be done. Array of batteries and/or capacitors at the supply point and draw continuously from the grid. Most entertain…

It definitely does not take an hour if you have an 800v car and an 800v EA station.

Can’t speak highly enough about lucid, but their current offerings are definitely not for the budget conscious, but that should change soon.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#182

Post by AngryData »

LeFantome wrote: post #176
somewhereoutth wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With 5 minute charging, suddenly conventional gas stations can be used for EVs just as they are for ICE. Nice thing about 'plugging in' as opposed to 'filling up' is that a charging car can be left completely unattended (while you go to pay, get a coffee, or whatever). Seems that the technological barriers have been overcome, now we just need to build out the infrastructure - which could be as simple as retooling exi…

An EV is in digital communication with the charging station. Why would you “go pay”? You don’t “go pay” at a Tesla Supercharger.

Not everyone wants to link their bank account to shady automotive companies or be paying automotive company charging price markup.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#183

Post by rasz »

Kirby64 wrote: post #153
sgt wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes that new one is not an i3, not even in spirit. The original i3 was super light, quirky, fun, innovative in so many ways. They just didn't sell enough. People wanted more boring cars.

It was also $50k for a car that only got 120-150mi of range. It was a joke car. The reason it didn’t sell well is because it was a compliance car, not because it didn’t innovative. If it had a reasonable range (say, Chevy Bolt 200-250ish) in all electric for the same price, I bet it would have sold much much better.

On the up side i3 are great second hand bargain at current ~$5K price point.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#184

Post by hbarka »

bigstrat2003 wrote: post #171
JonChesterfield wrote: post #145

If you can get a megawatt into the car batteries without setting them on fire, that's game over for petrol cars. And for the other electric vehicles that haven't worked it out yet. Only reason I'm on petrol is unwillingness to wait an hour to recharge the car. The rest of the infra is fine if that can be done. Array of batteries and/or capacitors at the supply point and draw continuously from the grid. Most entertain…

Agreed. Right now EVs are almost strictly superior for day to day usage (only real downside is that the higher weight goes through tires faster). But for road trips, combustion vehicles blow them out of the water. If I'm taking a 12 hour road trip, no way am I going to take an EV if that means I will have to spend an extra hour or two charging it. My wife has an EV and it's genuinely really nice. But until they get t…

For once or twice a year road trip I’d just rent a combustion car, otherwise it’ll just be sitting in the garage not good as a daily driver.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#185

Post by wesleyd »

Gas pumps in the US are artificially capped at 10 gallons per minute, and a gallon of gasoline is about 33kWh, so petrol cars in the US “charge” at 330kWh/min ~= 20MW. But most cars only turn about a third of that into motion, so let’s say 7MW equivalent? While BYD’s 1.5MW is amazing, it seems a stretch to call it “almost as fast as gas pumps.”

Diesel pumps for trucks typically pump much faster too. And diesel is nearer 40kWh/gal. We have a ways to go!

(The energy density of oil is amazing: a fully loaded A380 with 84,500 us gallons of jet fuel at 37.5 kWh per, that’s over 3TWh. Which is about twice the capacity of all the li-ion batteries made in 2025. We have a ways to go!)

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#186

Post by ffsm8 »

PearlRiver wrote: post #166
mbfg wrote: post #3

More importantly, the US has banned these cars in America to give protection to american manufacturers.

The Chinese were smart enough to ban US companies only when their own people could match.

That's underselling it, honestly.

They banned import/forced local production which ended in the trained workers then quitting and creating the competitor.

That pattern played out with every large company that tried to get into the Chinese market

The only surprising part about it is how these MBAs kept doing it across industries

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#187

Post by thelastgallon »

wesleyd wrote: post #185

Gas pumps in the US are artificially capped at 10 gallons per minute, and a gallon of gasoline is about 33kWh, so petrol cars in the US “charge” at 330kWh/min ~= 20MW. But most cars only turn about a third of that into motion, so let’s say 7MW equivalent? While BYD’s 1.5MW is amazing, it seems a stretch to call it “almost as fast as gas pumps.” Diesel pumps for trucks typically pump much faster too. And diesel is nea…

99.9% of use cases of EVs can charge at home/work/shop, don't need separate infrastructure, logistics and supply chains for delivery of electricity. There is a very small fraction of EV trips that need charging on the go. The vast majority of trips are under 3 (or 5 miles).

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#188

Post by est »

JonChesterfield wrote: post #145

If you can get a megawatt into the car batteries without setting them on fire, that's game over for petrol cars. And for the other electric vehicles that haven't worked it out yet. Only reason I'm on petrol is unwillingness to wait an hour to recharge the car. The rest of the infra is fine if that can be done. Array of batteries and/or capacitors at the supply point and draw continuously from the grid. Most entertain…

> If you can get a megawatt into the car batteries without setting them on fire, that's game over for petrol cars

Chinese people are complaining about this. In highway service stops, the megawatt charger is too fast, the 20%-95% charging is done before people returns from the toilet. Realistically, the charging speed should take around 10 minutes in average for everyone.

Or there could be some price surges. You are in a really hurry pay some 1.2x price for 3 min megawatt charge, or flat price for a regular 10 min charge.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#189

Post by est »

tim333 wrote: post #80
orbital-decay wrote: post #63

>Just taking an existing fast charger with 150- or 350-kW capacity and swapping in the latest and greatest 1,500-kW chargers wouldn’t get anyone faster speeds. The system would need all new “pipes”—grid capacity—to actually move that much current. The grid doesn't necessarily mean "pipes" or power lines. You don't build a pipeline to every gas station. Mobile charging robots work pretty well in China.

Also I guess they could put a large battery at the charging station so it can take say a steady 200kw from the grid and be able to kick out 1500kw for ten minutes occasionally. That could also charge from cheap off peak electricity.

> guess they could put a large battery at the charging station

BYD's megawatt charging does exactly that.

Tbe best part, the "large battery" uses the same battary on BYD cars. The same electric components, cooling system, etc.

Re: How BYD got EV chargers to work almost as fast as gas pumps

#190

Post by est »

nxm wrote: post #141
soared wrote: post #2

Is this how the US falls behind? Missing technological improvements due to blind disagreements with Chinese/etc, combined with inability to update infrastructure? (Unclear how/why but datacenters being stood up so quickly seems like an exception to US’s bad construction)

Not a single country can excel at everything, and China heavily subsidizes their auto industry to undercut competition. It is not a fair game.

China subsidizes Tesla and European EVs as well.
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