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Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

grocerydive.com

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Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#181

Post by georgefrowny »

fma wrote: post #97

Or their online groceries didnt succeed because people can p4ice shop. I am of the belief Kroger does well because they obfuscate their prices and their tags which make it seems like they are sales truely are not. Unlike Publix if I see a discount I know it is a discount. Every other item in Kroger has a yellow tag and a red price to make you think you are getting a deal when in fact the red number is higher than reg…

One of the reasons I kind of gave up on deliveries after COVID was the the experience of having a friendly but slightly rushed bloke clearly politely itching to get on to the next stop turn up at some random time in the evening (it's booked to a slot but the variance was large). Then he holds your door open and either helps you unload it watches you unload a bunch of randomly packed loose items from a large handful of his plastic crates, some with a single item in them, as fast as possible into laundry baskets in the hallway so you can transfer it to the right place at leisure. That was actually somehow really annoying to me.

Tesco used to use plastic box liners which you doing just hoick out, but those were quickly stopped due to bring plastic.

I'd rather they just handed over the crates or something and I could return them for a deposit the next time. Obviously I'd also rather all the supermarkets could share the same crates so I don't have to babysit piles of each brand separately.

Maybe Ocado have a better system then Tesco here?

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#182

Post by mapt »

Animats wrote: post #75
markus_zhang wrote: post #25

I had a wonderful retro futuristic dream about an automated Costco warehouse a few weeks ago. It was one of the less weird dreams so I still remember it clearly. Basically, each section is like a closed areas with some windows. Customers order at the computers by the windows and flash their membership cards. Robots glide left and right to move 10 samples to the customer, in an arm with rotating clips. Customers can p…

What you've re-invented is Keydoozle, from 1937.[1] This was the first automated grocery store. Three stores were opened, but there were enough mechanical problems that it didn't work well. [1] https://rarehistoricalphotos.com/keedoozle-automated-store-p...

And what some of us might not have the context for, is that grocery stores at the time were usually clerk-serviced; Just like you don't pump your own gas in New Jersey, at the time the norm was that you handed the clerk a list of products and they fetched them from the shelves for you.

Arguably this model has a great deal of compatibility with robotic compact storage, especially in high-land-value areas.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#183

Post by jnd-cz »

londons_explore wrote: post #152
simgt wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you comparing the cost of strictly identical products or something else? I'd be very curious to have some sources if you have any

No - small shops tend to sell mostly expensive branded products in smaller packets, whereas superstores sell larger packs of unbranded products.

In my country and city the small shops are largely stocked from buying the same things from larger shops combined with their own resupplying network. So you can either walk 100m to the corner shop, pay couple dozen % extra or walk 500m to the nearest Lidl or similar and save on basically the same products.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#184

Post by EB-Barrington »

simgt wrote: post #136
karamanolev wrote: post #123

I work in this exact space (online grocery retailer in Europe). We're profitable and one of the few companies to be so in the sector - many online divisions are losing money and being bankrolled by the parent company with physical stores. Alternatively, burning VC money. The thing that's wrong with Ocado's technology is that it's ridiculously expensive and tailored for huge FC's (fulfillment centers). The problem wit…

Where are you operating? I live in a dense European city and I don't know a single person who orders groceries online. Smallish shops with bike racks in front of the door are simply too convenient, seems hard to beat. Next few days shopping can easily be done in 15mn on the way back home.

[dead]

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#185

Post by jack_tripper »

danielbln wrote: post #154
simgt wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where are you operating? I live in a dense European city and I don't know a single person who orders groceries online. Smallish shops with bike racks in front of the door are simply too convenient, seems hard to beat. Next few days shopping can easily be done in 15mn on the way back home.

Berlin here, people order from bike delivery grocery stores all the time. Not necessarily to do your weekend shopping, but still.

Isn't this expensive after you factor in the extra margins and delivery costs?

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#186

Post by onraglanroad »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #39
markus_zhang wrote: post #25

I had a wonderful retro futuristic dream about an automated Costco warehouse a few weeks ago. It was one of the less weird dreams so I still remember it clearly. Basically, each section is like a closed areas with some windows. Customers order at the computers by the windows and flash their membership cards. Robots glide left and right to move 10 samples to the customer, in an arm with rotating clips. Customers can p…

Sounds like the old general store model, you didn’t browse yourself, the shop keep would bring out what you wanted, it was always behind the counter. I experienced this in China when I started visiting in 1999/early 2000s, it’s mostly not like that anymore though. You still have department stores where you need to buy things first before touching them, though.

Indeed. Always handy if you needed four candles.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#187

Post by roryirvine »

mapt wrote: post #180
roryirvine wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the thing, though - you'd think that this would result in these "heavyweight" Ocado-style home delivery options being more viable in the US than in London. And yet, they're not. Sure, you have Doordash-style same-hour options which are largely based on someone picking stuff up from a local store on your behalf (we have lots of those too). But the Ocado/Kroger robotic hive fulfilment centres ought to be more ef…

Another possibility: For perishable goods in the sort of SKU counts typically offered, it can't work unless it has a certain minimum scale. Local supermarkets supported by a largely automated (and has been for 30 years) regional distribution center have that scale from walk-in traffic. A new delivery service using high-density storage could save on real estate and labor costs on the backend, but it has to have runway…

Sure, but that's a matter of raising capital - which, again, you would think would favour the US over the UK.

To be fair, though, the bulk of Ocado's initial investors were from the retail and finance worlds - and the difference between the US and UK is smaller in those fields than it is for tech.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#188

Post by jcims »

imroot wrote: post #103

I've always said that in the back of my mind, the most successful grocery store would be the 'walls' of the store -- bakery, deli, produce, meats, floral, cheeses, dairy and having a little selection of store brands in the middle where consumers can pick up (and vendors can pay a premium for endcap space, because they're the only non-branded products out there), with the rest of the SKU's behind the walls of the groc…

This gave me a flashback to Service Merchandise. No idea how widespread they were, but that's how it operated. You'd collect tags for the things you want, take them to the counter, wait a bit and your order would roll out on a belt. Pull your car up, load it and leave.

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#189

Post by joncrocks »

georgefrowny wrote: post #181
fma wrote: post #97

Or their online groceries didnt succeed because people can p4ice shop. I am of the belief Kroger does well because they obfuscate their prices and their tags which make it seems like they are sales truely are not. Unlike Publix if I see a discount I know it is a discount. Every other item in Kroger has a yellow tag and a red price to make you think you are getting a deal when in fact the red number is higher than reg…

One of the reasons I kind of gave up on deliveries after COVID was the the experience of having a friendly but slightly rushed bloke clearly politely itching to get on to the next stop turn up at some random time in the evening (it's booked to a slot but the variance was large). Then he holds your door open and either helps you unload it watches you unload a bunch of randomly packed loose items from a large handful o…

Ocado (at least in the UK) pack items into plastic bags inside the crates, which makes unloading easier at the doorstep.

You are charged for the bags (in the UK you have to charge 5p for plastic bags) but are refunded when you return them (during a later delivery).

Re: Kroger acknowledges that its bet on robotics went too far

#190

Post by danielbln »

jack_tripper wrote: post #185
danielbln wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Berlin here, people order from bike delivery grocery stores all the time. Not necessarily to do your weekend shopping, but still.

Isn't this expensive after you factor in the extra margins and delivery costs?

Well, ish. German grocery prices are still quite low, comparatively. People use the delivery services not for full weekend shopping, more if you get home late and the fridge is empty, or a public holiday is coming up etc.

Still, they are popular.

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