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A $20 drug in Europe requires a prescription and $800 in the U.S.

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Re: A $20 drug in Europe requires a prescription and $800 in the U.S.

#181

Post by dns_snek »

yoyohello13 wrote: post #151
sgerenser wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah this is something people in favor of single payer healthcare in the U.S. don’t want to acknowledge. In most other countries, the middle 50% of taxpayers pay a much higher percentage of their income than in the U.S. Everyone somehow thinks we can make it work just by raising taxes on “the rich” (where that is usually defined as anyone making more money than them). But if it was that easy, then why does Canada and…

I'm curious what the actual number is. I have health insurance through my work and I pay over $1,500 a month for that (and still have out of pocket costs). That's $18,000 a year. That's a substantial percentage of my income which essentially is just a tax going to the insurance company instead of the government. Now if it cost a couple thousand more a year and I didn't have to worry about getting claims denied for ra…

The US spends more money on healthcare than any other country (per capita and in PPP-adjusted terms), with the lowest life expectancy out of all of its peers [1].

Make of that what you will, but that tells me that after cutting out all the corporate abuse and inefficiency, the average person should be spending about the same for similar standard of care, except without all the bureaucracy and stress.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_hea...

Re: A $20 drug in Europe requires a prescription and $800 in the U.S.

#182

Post by CTDOCodebases »

Insanity wrote: post #12
Aurornis wrote: post #8

FYI for anyone who isn't familiar with the wacky US insurance situation: Nobody in the US actually pays $800 for the drug. That's the "list price" for insurance companies to pay. Even insurance companies don't pay that price because they negotiate their own rates with the drug companies, which are lower. Then the drug companies come in and offer a "savings card" which you apply at the pharmacy like another layer of i…

I think that might be worse than just having the high price. Such a kafka-esque systems just to get medicine.

It's the efficiency of capitalism at work.

It's more efficient to allocate capital to systems and processes that delay or stop you claiming on your insurance than it is to actually pay out a genuine claim.

Re: A $20 drug in Europe requires a prescription and $800 in the U.S.

#183

Post by quantum_state »

Aurornis wrote: post #8

FYI for anyone who isn't familiar with the wacky US insurance situation: Nobody in the US actually pays $800 for the drug. That's the "list price" for insurance companies to pay. Even insurance companies don't pay that price because they negotiate their own rates with the drug companies, which are lower. Then the drug companies come in and offer a "savings card" which you apply at the pharmacy like another layer of i…

The real question is: how much does the drug cost, independent of who pays for it?

Re: A $20 drug in Europe requires a prescription and $800 in the U.S.

#184

Post by standardUser »

Someone1234 wrote: post #132
petercooper wrote: post #115

However, it’s not all roses. Try getting melatonin in the UK. You can buy it almost anywhere in the US. Same for any first generation antihistamines. Or a jar of painkillers - packets are limited to 16 here. Or lidocaine cream. Whenever I go to the US, I have a shopping list to restock our medicine cabinet.

That's a very selective example. The US controls TONS of hormones, Melatonin just got grandfathered in. If anything the UK system is more self-consistent than the US, even if I think both systems over-protect hormones with a low risk profile (like Melatonin in the UK). As a counter-example, up until fairly recently you could buy Co-codamol (codeine, an opioid) in the UK off-the-shelf (i.e. no script). Which is a cont…

In terms of access to drugs, the differences between countries is incoherent, not really a "good vs bad" situation. A lot of it has to do with the different ways nations fumble their endless (yet fruitless) attempts to limit abuse and recreational use.

But in terms of cost, the US system is bad. If we as a nation want to invest in drug development, we should do so. Instead we ask grandma and grandpa and the chronically ill to flip the bill. Hard to think of a worse approach.

Re: A $20 drug in Europe requires a prescription and $800 in the U.S.

#185

Post by rorylawless »

petercooper wrote: post #115

However, it’s not all roses. Try getting melatonin in the UK. You can buy it almost anywhere in the US. Same for any first generation antihistamines. Or a jar of painkillers - packets are limited to 16 here. Or lidocaine cream. Whenever I go to the US, I have a shopping list to restock our medicine cabinet.

You can get larger packs of painkillers OTC by speaking with a pharmacist (OTC in the literal sense) or ordering online. For example, Boots sells a 96 count 400mg ibuprofen.

https://www.boots.com/boots-ibuprofen-caplets-400mg-96s-1026...

Re: A $20 drug in Europe requires a prescription and $800 in the U.S.

#186

Post by monerozcash »

daveguy wrote: post #150
cogman10 wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anyone know what's going on with the ACA marketplace? I like to take a peek at it every so often and it's just stupendously worse than employer healthcare. There is no plan in my market (Idaho) which doesn't have extreme out of network deductibles. The cost is also identical to what I and my employer pay for insurance. Is it just that the ACA is mostly used by sick people or something?

It's because health insurance companies need to pad their profits. Because we have a backward system in the US where profits are extracted by everyone without any competition from a not-for-profit. That's why the idea of a public option is so popular (it was originally a Republican idea until it was decided insurance company profits are more desirable). Personally, I don't think any health insurance company should be…

Pretty sure Kaiser Permanente is not-for-profit, many Blue Cross Blue Shield members are non-profit

Re: A $20 drug in Europe requires a prescription and $800 in the U.S.

#188

Post by OutOfHere »

cyberax wrote: post #135
OutOfHere wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Instead of putting and accumulating PFAS in your body, just get punctal cauterization. No drops will be needed thereafter.

I have punctal plugs. They helped quite a bit, but for most people with dry eyes it's the lack of the lipid layer that is causing problems. Not the lack of water.

Punctual plugs are not as great as cauterization for multiple reasons. Firstly, plugs keep dropping off and getting lost over time. Secondly, they probably won't seal the gap fully.

The lipid emission will heal partially if one supplements vitamin A (10k IU) softgel, omega-3 triglyceride ester, taurine, and at least 4K IU of vitamin D3. It will heal enough to work. The D3 in this dose is for freezing autoimmune degeneration.

I have severe dry eye and I never need any drops except if I am wearing contact lenses.

Re: A $20 drug in Europe requires a prescription and $800 in the U.S.

#189

Post by GenerWork »

pmontra wrote: post #153
AlexCoventry wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There are three blood thinners on the US market and they all cost a lot. What about Warfarin? Its $21 for 30 pills, according to https://www.goodrx.com/warfarin

Warfarin needs blood tests at least every 2 or 3 weeks. I bet those tests are not cheap in the USA. Furthermore you can't have any food with significant amounts of vitamine K or its precursors. There are pills that cost more but don't require any of that. And actually they cost very little or zero, at least in my European country. Prescription only, of course.

>I bet those tests are not cheap in the USA.

Within 5 minutes of searching I found a PT time with INR test for $24 [0]. Add in the testing fee and it's probably around $30.

[0] https://www.ultalabtests.com/test/prothrombin-time-with-inr-...

Re: A $20 drug in Europe requires a prescription and $800 in the U.S.

#190

Post by postsantum »

raverbashing wrote: post #166
rootusrootus wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Whenever I go to the US, I have a shopping list to restock our medicine cabinet Ha, that's funny, I do something kind of like that when I go to the UK. Though it's just one medicine -- Kwells. Easily available OTC there, not available at all here in the US except as a prescription-only transdermal patch.

+1 This is the "exception that proves the rule" I guess One of the best OTC medicine for motion sickeness hand down Dramamine is (almost literally) a bad joke

What's the deal with Dramamine? It's pushed everywhere but it has zero effect on me, I even tried 4 pills at once, nothing at all
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