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Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

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Re: Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

#181
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never had a driver's licence, lived in a zillion countries; don't think I could do that in America though.

Over half of New York City households are car-free. That jumps to 3/4 in Manhattan. Millions of American households don’t have a car, but you rarely hear about it as a viable option.

I would argue that even in NYC, having a car is necessary if you ever want to leave NYC (and you will want to).

Re: Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

#182

I ripped the wifi / onstar and gps antennas out of my 2020 Chevy Bolt the day after I bought it. Took me a couple of hours since the access was awful, but that's one time pain. No issues since, and I have a phone I use to drive the head unit so there was no need for those antennas to even exist.

I tried this once.

I got a tesla home charger and it had a unnecessary wifi AP that kept showing up in my house. So I figured, I would stop this.

Opened it up, and disconnected the wifi antenna mmcx connector.

Nope, seemed when unplugged, it would switch to an onboard antenna for the wifi module.

so I reconnected a dummy load antenna to the wifi module.

and it still used the onboard antenna.

at that point, I gave up.

I think there might have been a possibility of downgrading the firmware to an older version that could disable wifi, but I didn't try to find it.

I believe this kind of thing happens with onboard cellular, wifi and bt. They are more resilient to degraded or disconnected antennas than you think.

Re: Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

#183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok stop with the panicking. What's wrong with GPS in vehicles? If it's not connected to the internet, there is no issue. What's wrong with playing music from the phone on Bluetooth or Aux? Did you also know you can ride a horse instead of a car? Bluetooth and WiFi isn't running if you turned them off. Bluetooth also isn't really used for tracking unless someone is looking for you or you're part of some service like A…

If it's not connected to the internet, there is no issue. It's connected to the Internet. Every car has a SIM card now.

[deleted]

Re: Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

#184
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because as soon as you leave a major metropolitan area, not having a car is almost a nonstarter.

It's the same in Europe, but people pushing an agenda don't talk about that either.

The US takes this to an entirely different level.

In places like Vegas, even on days with great weather, trying to WALK 2-3km in residential areas is a nightmare.

Re: Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

#185
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I integrated SecOC on some ECU's at work. I hate myself for it. I frigging hate what they're doing with this. I think it's going to make cars less repairable, less modifiable. It's a horrible horrible stupid initiative in the name of "cybersecurity".

I understand notionally where they were going, but it all sort of went off the deep end somewhere along the line. A concern that someone buying some "mileage blocker" or whatever other shady device off of AliExpress might be vulnerable to the device steering their car into a wall is actually quite a valid one, but of course the solution is some overcomplicated AUTOSAR nightmare that doesn't solve for key provisioning…

I have less trust in their good intentions. I think OEM's want to lock down their platforms in order to squeeze extra revenue streams. And I tend to be quite charitable with my interpretations.

As an aside, I checked out your GitHub. Cool projects, the vag flashing tool looks super useful, might actually give it a spin in sive development projects.

Re: Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

#186
post #118

I thought about getting a traditional navigator to avoid even relying on phone navigation. Well, of course all the Garmins and Tomtoms available now have "built-in wifi for updates" and often BT for phone notifications too. Sure, I could just not configure either but what if I want a navigator _without any radios_ and with controlled updates via SD card. Maybe a dedicated Android phone in the car with offline OpenStr…

I use an older Garmin, purchased from ebay. Works fine, updated maps via a laptop recently. Needed an extra SD cards for space.

Re: Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

#187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh man. Logging insane average speeds and ludicrous acceleration during rush hour. Deliciously tempting idea.

A data scientist will simply filter out impossible data when conducting an analysis

you give a lot of credit to an industry poisoned by the profit motive

Re: Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

#188

as a professional diesel mechanic for a small chain of midwest shops, this "telematics" feature is on long-haul trucks as well as tractors (john deer is notorious for using it to send mail marketing about services.) generally its not hard to disable. - identify the telematics module in your car - pull the fuse (not always an option, sometimes this disables bluetooth) - alternatively: identify the 1-2 SMC connectors o…

I tried this with a wifi setup on a car charger. I connected a 50-ohm dummy load in place of the antenna using the mmcx connector.

It didn't work - there was an on-module antenna that it switched to. Might not have worked as well, but it did work and the wifi access point still showed up.

On the other hand, some cars have a self-contained telematics module like you said and you can just unpower the whole thing.

I remember looking at a ford owners manual for a 2019. The fusebox section had a fuse with description "Telematics control unit - modem." I assume you can just pull that fuse.

Re: Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

#189
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The CAN traffic is unencrypted. It was pretty easy to MITM this module with a cheap arm Linux board And you didn't poison their databases and statistics with fake data?? OMG, I'm thinking of buying one of these cars just for this opportunity! (No, I'm not.)

Oh man. Logging insane average speeds and ludicrous acceleration during rush hour. Deliciously tempting idea.

Draw the old twig and berries in gps coordinates in hundreds of random cities, with velocity between points carefully kept to regular traffic speeds every single day until they shut the modem off.

Re: Modern cars are spying on you. Here's what you can do about it

#190
post #20

My 2025 Mazda Miata has a CAN connected Telematics Control Unit that sends a bunch of data to Mazda on ignition off. Among this data is acceleration and velocity data along with coordinates sampled for where you were. It is also used as a gateway for the Mazda app to start your car, query your vehicle's tire pressure, etc. It is claimed that you can opt out of this by calling Mazda and being persistent. The CAN traff…

I see absolutely no reason not to completely unplug the cellular modem. The only thing that would stop me is an annoying error message or warning light in the gauge cluster. My car does not display any of these, but unplugging the modem results in losing the right speaker and microphone, unless a bypass harness is used.
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