Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

181–190 of 232 posts

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#181

Post by AlotOfReading »

evanelias wrote: post #178
swatcoder wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was sure you were exaggerating. But no! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCVkA1xebrQ It turns out the one in this ad is in Altoona, Iowa. The ad focuses on how it revitalized the community by providing jobs, kind of glossing over how that might be reflected in the massive facility's ~30 car parking lot. And incidentally, that data center currently shows no open positions on Meta's career website, although third-part…

That data center started operation over a decade ago. There's no reason to assume it should have any vacancies currently, nor is there any reason to assume its positions were largely filled by non-locals. And even if a few external folks relocated in some cases, isn't that economically beneficial to the area regardless? Also given the 24/7/365 nature of data center operation, the number of employees will be larger th…

Meta says over 400 people work on-site at the Altoona facility [0], but most of those are clearly working for a variety of smaller contractors given that the initial tax terms anticipated a few dozen direct employees [edit: wrong state] and no datacenter companies show up in the county's 50 largest employers [1].

[0] https://corridorbusiness.com/data-centers-bringing-big-numbe...

[1] https://www.pa.gov/content/dam/copapwp-pagov/en/dli/document...

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#182

Post by jrflowers »

JimmyBuckets wrote: post #171
jrflowers wrote: post #159

HN commenters flustered, baffled by the words on the screen: “Why would he say it like that? The phrasing is so foreign, it’s like the author wants me to laugh at it. The only way to understand this is to ask a chat bot what I should think the point is”

This is the lamest place to do ragebait. Facebook is probably more fun.

I appreciate this serious response to a joke about hn users not identifying jokes in a thread where hn posters are treating a comedy blog like an actual bond rating service

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#183

Post by pas »

tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #176

Isn't the point that they intentionally glossed over ("We did not model what would happen if data center demand collapses and Meta cannot secure a new tenant. This scenario was excluded for methodological convenience.") a pretty important one? If I understand the explanations on HN, the complaint is that Meta is taking on debt, which would normally affect its credit rating, so they're "hiding" the debt in a LLC witho…

someone has to service the debt, and Meta has obligations to pay if the company cannot find any other tenant - if I understood correctly

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#184

Post by evanelias »

AlotOfReading wrote: post #181
evanelias wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That data center started operation over a decade ago. There's no reason to assume it should have any vacancies currently, nor is there any reason to assume its positions were largely filled by non-locals. And even if a few external folks relocated in some cases, isn't that economically beneficial to the area regardless? Also given the 24/7/365 nature of data center operation, the number of employees will be larger th…

Meta says over 400 people work on-site at the Altoona facility [0], but most of those are clearly working for a variety of smaller contractors given that the initial tax terms anticipated a few dozen direct employees [edit: wrong state] and no datacenter companies show up in the county's 50 largest employers [1]. [0] https://corridorbusiness.com/data-centers-bringing-big-numbe... [1] https://www.pa.gov/content/dam/co…

The datacenter is in Altoona, Iowa. Your second link is about the county containing Altoona, Pennsylvania. Ditto for your population size number.

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#185

Post by pas »

skybrian wrote: post #162
siliconpotato wrote: post #27

There are better articles explaining this: https://www.forbes.com/sites/petercohan/2025/11/25/metas-ai-... and https://www.wsj.com/tech/meta-ai-data-center-finances-d3a6b4...

The Forbes article says that "to be an operating lease [...] Meta must have the obligation to absorb the venture’s losses or the right to receive its benefits." I don't know enough about finance to tell for sure, but this seems backwards?

it seems to mean that Meta would have to "rent" the whole operation (with all the potential upside and downside)

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#186

Post by alex1138 »

lxgr wrote: post #44
mertd wrote: post #19

This is hardly a secret. Matt Levine blogged about it: https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/newsletters/2025-10-29/put...

Does it need to be a secret to be noteworthy, especially if it’s apparently working despite not being a secret anymore?

This is HN, you're supposed to say "is anyone surprised" and sprinkle in the word Nothingburger and other naval gazing platitudes I'm sure I can think of

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#187

Post by [deleted] »

hattmall wrote: post #150
mcny wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought the whole point of LLC was to limit liability so you wouldn't be liable for debt beyond your paid up capital? Why would you ever sign a personal guarantee?

>Why would you ever sign a personal guarantee? So that they will lend you the money... It's not always required, depends on the amount and the business.

[deleted]

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#188

Post by AlotOfReading »

evanelias wrote: post #184
AlotOfReading wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meta says over 400 people work on-site at the Altoona facility [0], but most of those are clearly working for a variety of smaller contractors given that the initial tax terms anticipated a few dozen direct employees [edit: wrong state] and no datacenter companies show up in the county's 50 largest employers [1]. [0] https://corridorbusiness.com/data-centers-bringing-big-numbe... [1] https://www.pa.gov/content/dam/co…

The datacenter is in Altoona, Iowa. Your second link is about the county containing Altoona, Pennsylvania. Ditto for your population size number.

Thanks, updated to reflect the correction.

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#189

Post by phendrenad2 »

Aurornis wrote: post #101
illwrks wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So… ‘vanity’ ratings… what’s the point of them then.

There are a lot of places where the credit ratings are hardcoded (to borrow a term) into funds. There are pension funds and other vehicles that might be bound to only invest in AA rated companies. So if a company drops their AA rating it could force them out of a lot of funds and investment vehicles. This complicated vehicle where the debt and assets are in another LLC isn’t actually tricking anyone in finance. If yo…

Funds and investment vehicles subtly lowering their standards while the downstream investors remain clueless is how we got 2008, no?

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#190

Post by kjs3 »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #15
colinbartlett wrote: post #3

Can anyone comment about how common this (apparently legal) practice is?

Setting up a separate company for a major construction project is so common that it would be surprising to hear someone didn’t do it. The structure of the OP makes it hard to understand if there’s some more specific aspect he’s objecting to.

Film industry, too, as I understand it. Pretty much every production is set up with it's own LLC.
Post reply on HN