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KDE Plasma 6.8 Will Go Wayland-Exclusive in Dropping X11 Session Support

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Re: KDE Plasma 6.8 Will Go Wayland-Exclusive in Dropping X11 Session Support

#181

Post by array_key_first »

o11c wrote: post #142
exceptione wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are they denying? You can continue using Xwayland for *most* X applications. I think they explain your options quite well in this blog post: https://blogs.kde.org/2025/11/26/going-all-in-on-a-wayland-f... As they say, distro's like "AlmaLinux 9 includes the Plasma X11 session and will be supported until sometime in 2032".

That's like saying "my car has most of its components working", when it has no engine, only 12V battery power. For me personally , the first dealbreaker I keep hitting is the fact that input-method-adjacent keyboard logic is quite broken (necessary if you ever want to use a language other than English, even temporarily). There are also, of course, the innumerable minor bugs that will be fixed from one release to the…

X11 has never been 'stable', in my experience. It's janky as all fuck. Constant stuttering and tearing, and looks slightly different on every piece of hardware, even from the same manufacturer.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.8 Will Go Wayland-Exclusive in Dropping X11 Session Support

#182

Post by o11c »

array_key_first wrote: post #181
o11c wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's like saying "my car has most of its components working", when it has no engine, only 12V battery power. For me personally , the first dealbreaker I keep hitting is the fact that input-method-adjacent keyboard logic is quite broken (necessary if you ever want to use a language other than English, even temporarily). There are also, of course, the innumerable minor bugs that will be fixed from one release to the…

X11 has never been 'stable', in my experience. It's janky as all fuck. Constant stuttering and tearing, and looks slightly different on every piece of hardware, even from the same manufacturer.

Tearing is 100% a matter of whether your video drivers are tuned for benchmarks or desktop use; just set an environment variable.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.8 Will Go Wayland-Exclusive in Dropping X11 Session Support

#184

Post by array_key_first »

o11c wrote: post #182
array_key_first wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

X11 has never been 'stable', in my experience. It's janky as all fuck. Constant stuttering and tearing, and looks slightly different on every piece of hardware, even from the same manufacturer.

Tearing is 100% a matter of whether your video drivers are tuned for benchmarks or desktop use; just set an environment variable.

Not in my experience, it ends up working some places and not others and will also stop working intermittently. Also stuttering, flickering, artifacts... these just don't happen on Wayland for me. It's the smoothest desktop experience I've ever had, and that includes Windows, which, to be fair, is a low bar.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.8 Will Go Wayland-Exclusive in Dropping X11 Session Support

#185

Post by ac29 »

o11c wrote: post #99
elcritch wrote: post #33

I tried Wayland earlier today on my home lab with Plasma and FreeBSD. It seemed pretty great for a bit and ran my monitor at 120Hz. Until it hard crashed my machine after I opened discord in firefox. Konqueror crashed on opening.

Yes, Wayland is broken by design, since a single crash takes down the whole desktop; unlike other Wayland complaints, this one fundamentally will never be fixed. This is unlike X11, where it was very common to recover from the inevitable single-component crashes.

> Wayland is broken by design, since a single crash takes down the whole desktop

A single crash of what? I have used a Wayland only system for a long time and application-level crashes certainly don't bring down other applications much less the whole desktop.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.8 Will Go Wayland-Exclusive in Dropping X11 Session Support

#186

Post by o11c »

ac29 wrote: post #185
o11c wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, Wayland is broken by design, since a single crash takes down the whole desktop; unlike other Wayland complaints, this one fundamentally will never be fixed. This is unlike X11, where it was very common to recover from the inevitable single-component crashes.

> Wayland is broken by design, since a single crash takes down the whole desktop A single crash of what? I have used a Wayland only system for a long time and application-level crashes certainly don't bring down other applications much less the whole desktop.

Crashes of the now-merged display server / window manager / whatever. Why does everybody keep talking about "applications" like they're the problem people have with Wayland? Our problem is the Wayland server itself.

Both window manager and shell were historically extremely likely to crash, whereas the display server was very resilient (and the session script would restart the WM and shell as needed). I'm not sure how separate the shell is nowadays, but more than just the traditional duties of a WM have been embugged into the display server.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.8 Will Go Wayland-Exclusive in Dropping X11 Session Support

#187

Post by surajrmal »

electroly wrote: post #64
kanbankaren wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did you arrive at 125%? What is the formula? Just eyeballing? I set DPI so that a 15pt font occupies 15pt physical space on screen. Not sure how to set DPI using fractional scaling.

The formula is DPI ÷ 96. 100% is 96 dpi, 125% is 120 dpi.

Doesn't that depend on how far you sit from the screen?

Re: KDE Plasma 6.8 Will Go Wayland-Exclusive in Dropping X11 Session Support

#188

Post by KetoManx64 »

bigyabai wrote: post #149
greenavocado wrote: post #147

KeepassXC (a must-have application and dealbreaker) is still broken on Wayland. The recommended "solution" is to edit the .desktop file to resemble the following: QT_QPA_PLATFORM=wayland ECORE_EVAS_ENGINE=wayland_egl ELM_ENGINE=wayland_egl SDL_VIDEODRIVER=wayland _JAVA_AWT_WM_NONREPARENTING=1 keepassxc https://github.com/keepassxreboot/keepassxc/issues/2973

There are lots of Keepass clients you can use. My go-to on Wayland is Secrets: https://apps.gnome.org/Secrets/

So I'll have to download all the GNOME bloat to run this within KDE?

Re: KDE Plasma 6.8 Will Go Wayland-Exclusive in Dropping X11 Session Support

#189

Post by elcritch »

wkat4242 wrote: post #123
elcritch wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And KDE on X11 on FreeBSD seems pretty stable so far. Feels super snappy so far.

It is yes! It's great. What I like about FreeBSD is the decoupling of packages and OS. You can have a stable OS version but still have rolling packages. Somehow most Linux distros can't manage that. I also like that I don't constantly have to learn new stuff like the new ip commands or systemd. It just works. Oh and ZFS on root as a first class citizen is amazing of course.

> What I like about FreeBSD is the decoupling of packages and OS. You can have a stable OS version but still have rolling packages. Somehow most Linux distros can't manage that.

This! I didn't realize how much I wanted this. FreeBSD release base packages are stable but all the regular packages are super up to date. Plasma looks very updated and stable.

I've tried rolling distros like Opensuse Tumble and Manjaro but eventually if you don't update them regularly you get a huge change and often many things change/break. Had your bluetooth speakers working finally? Now that's gone!

On the other hand stable releases in linux distros also seem to fail. Didn't update your random Ubuntu server in the corner of the office for the last year? Well now the apt links are broken and down for the release so you can't update the current release so you can upgrade.

> I also like that I don't constantly have to learn new stuff like the new ip commands or systemd. It just works. Oh and ZFS on root as a first class citizen is amazing of course.

It's nice, many of the same basics I learned on freebsd 6 years ago all still magically work. ifconfig works even with ipv6. You learn two files and you can do most anything.

I'm definitely gonna consider Freebsd for embedded devices if I can as well. You dint need buildroot or yocto as it's already part of the BSDs.

Re: KDE Plasma 6.8 Will Go Wayland-Exclusive in Dropping X11 Session Support

#190

Post by KetoManx64 »

marcodiego wrote: post #105
ferguess_k wrote: post #52

I live in a cave and am not a system programmer -- what's so wrong with X11 so people need to replace it with something else instead of improving it? Or, what's so wrong with anything so people need to replace it with something else instead of improving it? Let's say I'm an old man favoring improving existing stuffs instead of starting from scratch. I like debugging and wish to work as a sys programmer specialized in…

Just one example: Around 2009 I met Thiago Vignatti. His master thesis was about improving X so it was easy to use in a multi-seat setup (2 monitors/keyboard/mouse) so a single computer could be simultaneously used by two people. He later worked for Nokia, Intel and eventually his own startup related to VR. During his time as a Google summer of code student, his project was to paralelize X code so it could run in mul…

So does Wayland actually solve this issue? From the stats I've seen Wayland either very slightly outperforms X11 or it's the other way around.
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