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Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

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Re: Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

#181

Post by survirtual »

poulpy123 wrote: post #175
visarga wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My 8 year old nephew was cranking out "songs" in Suno within an hour of being introduced to it. Reminds me of when parents were super impressed that their 3-year old could use an iPad. You imply "it is Prompt -> Song" but in reality it is "Prompt -> Song -> Reflection -> New Prompt -> New Song.." It is a dialogue. And in a dialogue you can get some places where neither of you could go alone. As software developers…

clicking on a button until you like what you hear is not "making music". I have nothing against these tools, but the hubris of the people using them is insane

Dumping money into a company until desired results is not "building a company". I have nothing against capital, but the hubris of the people investing is insane. /s

Look, sarcasm aside, for you and the many people who agree with you, I would encourage opening your minds a bit. There was a time where even eating food was an intense struggle of intellect, skill, and patience. Now you walk into a building and grab anything you desire in exchange for money.

You can model this as a sort of "manifestation delta." The delta time & effort for acquiring food was once large, now it is small.

This was once true for nearly everything. Many things are now much much easier.

I know it is difficult to cope with, because many held a false belief that the arts were some kind of untouchable holy grail of pure humanness, never to be remotely approached by technology. But here we are, it didn't actually take much to make even that easier. The idea that this was somehow "the thing" that so many pegged their souls to, I would actually call THAT hubris.

Turns out, everyone needs to dig a bit deeper to learn who we really are.

This generative AI stuff is just another phase of a long line of evolution via technology for humanity. It means that more people can get what they want easier. They can go from thought to manifestation faster. This is a good thing.

The artists will still make art, just like blacksmiths still exist, or bow hunters still exist, or all the myriad of "old ways" still exist. They just won't be needed. They will be wanted, but they won't be needed.

The less middlemen to creation, the better. And when someone desires a thing created, and they put in the money, compute time, and prompting to thusly do so, then they ARE the creator. Without them, the manifestation would stay in a realm of unrealized dreams. The act itself of shifting idea to reality is the act of creation. It doesn't matter how easy it is or becomes.

Your struggle to create is irrelevant to the energy of creation.

Re: Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

#182

Post by j4coh »

survirtual wrote: post #181
poulpy123 wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

clicking on a button until you like what you hear is not "making music". I have nothing against these tools, but the hubris of the people using them is insane

Dumping money into a company until desired results is not "building a company". I have nothing against capital, but the hubris of the people investing is insane. /s Look, sarcasm aside, for you and the many people who agree with you, I would encourage opening your minds a bit. There was a time where even eating food was an intense struggle of intellect, skill, and patience. Now you walk into a building and grab anyth…

It doesn’t even have to be art. If someone told me they were a chef and cooked some food but in reality had ordered it I’d think they were a bit of a moron for equating these things or thinking that by giving someone money or a request for something they were a creator, not a consumer.

It may be nice for society that ordering food is possible, but it doesn’t make one a chef to have done so.

Re: Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

#183

Post by throwaway422432 »

protocolture wrote: post #177
poulpy123 wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

clicking on a button until you like what you hear is not "making music". I have nothing against these tools, but the hubris of the people using them is insane

Refining a request that generates music, is "making music" however you slice it.

I messed around with Udio when it first cam out, and it wasn't just writing a prompt, and there's your song.

You got 30 seconds, of which there might have been a hook that was interesting. So you would crop the hook and re-generate to get another 30 seconds before or after that, and so on.

I would liken it more as being the producer stitching together the sessions a band have recorded to produce a song.

Re: Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

#184

Post by 3036e4 »

suyash wrote: post #171
jjulius wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>... but "learning Suno" is no different than "learning guitar". No it absolutely is not.

The difference shows up when you perform - perform with Suno on stage and then with Guitar, you will know then.

Live programming music using tools like SuperCollider is/was a (very niche) thing. Someone is on stage with a laptop and, starting from a blank screen that is typically projected for everyone to see, types in code that makes sounds (and sometimes visual effects). A lot of it involves procedurally generated sounds using simple random generators. Live prompting as part of such shows would not seem entirely out of place and someone might figure out how to make that work as a performance?

Re: Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

#185

Post by otabdeveloper4 »

Nursie wrote: post #139
creata wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And look at the vocaloid stuff too. What about the vocaloid stuff?

It’s soulless by definition, designed by committee and sung by a machine. Entirely manufactured. But people like it. It’s a counterpoint to the above argument that listeners will be dismissive of AI-produced music because it is a pale imitation of art created with intent and soul. On the contrary, such music thrives and is very popular already.

AI "music" sounds like ass. The Temu of sonic products. It will sell, but only in niche markets. Traditionally manufactured pop "music" is a more upscale and widely applicable market position.

Re: Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

#186

Post by schwartzworld »

songeater wrote: post #107

Tools like Suno are fundamentally enabling. I'm about 40 years old and never "had the music" - not for lack of trying (music lessons at a young age)... but could never carry a tune or keep rhythm. I suppose its what being dyslexic feels like. If I were educated in a culture where music was fundamentally as important as reading or math, I suppose would have spent enough hours on it to eventually be passable... but I g…

> learning suno is no different than learning guitar

It most definitely is different and you’ve proven it with your own post. Guitar takes a long time to get to a place where you can produce the sounds you hear in your head. Suno gives you instant gratification.

Look, if it gives you pleasure to make Suno music then you should do it, but if you think having an ai steal a melody and add it to your songs counts is the same as creating something, you’re kiddo by yourself. At best you are a lyricist relying on a robocomposer to do the hard part. You could have achieved the same thing years ago by collaborating with a musician like Bernie Taupin did with Elton John.

Re: Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

#187

Post by Mc_Big_G »

dumpsterdiver wrote: post #138
lomase wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do love generative music. I don't care if you get your notes from a markov chain a shif register a LLM or your brain. The problem with AI music is that is just sounds like shit.

Even AI generated dubstep? https://suno.com/s/gJhedd4hmIsHbccc https://suno.com/s/qfFWu3kyQ2cXW8mT

Yes

Re: Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

#188

Post by jkulubya »

songeater wrote: post #107

Tools like Suno are fundamentally enabling. I'm about 40 years old and never "had the music" - not for lack of trying (music lessons at a young age)... but could never carry a tune or keep rhythm. I suppose its what being dyslexic feels like. If I were educated in a culture where music was fundamentally as important as reading or math, I suppose would have spent enough hours on it to eventually be passable... but I g…

I’ll agree that you+ai is creating a pleasant sequence of sounds ie music. And I don’t think anyone has the right to say (within reason) what is music or isn’t.

But we might need new vocabulary to differentiate that from the act of learning & using different layers of musical theory + physical ability on an instrument (including tools like supercollider) + your lived experience as a human to produce music.

Maybe some day soon all the songs on the radio and Spotify will be ai generated and hyper personalized and we’ll happily dance to it, but I’ll bet my last dollar that as long as humans exist, they’ll continue grinding away (manually?) at whatever musical instrument of the time.

Re: Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

#189

Post by Aldipower »

Veedrac wrote: post #133
freejazz wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The poster you are responding to did not make any reference to "consumer preference"

I was using ‘consumer preference’ here as a proxy for ‘the things that people tend to care about.’ The point I'm highlighting is that it's weird that when AI audio comes up, there's a reliable crowd of people discrediting it for missing a thing that clearly doesn't matter that much to most people in most contexts. It's like, sure you can want things from music that are to your specific taste, but it's like coming int…

You still totally miss the point of this thread. Making music and creating art for the sake of enjoyment. Consumer preferences are irrelevant here. I am totally fine if you like AI music. And I am sure someone can create art by interweaving AI elements. And keep in mind, the training data for Suno is coming/gets stolen from someone like me who creates real music. Personally I do not enjoy to make music with some proprietary 3rd party tools that can garden wall at every time, like Suno. But that is personal preference.

Re: Suno Studio, a Generative AI DAW

#190

Post by cowboylowrez »

songeater wrote: post #107

Tools like Suno are fundamentally enabling. I'm about 40 years old and never "had the music" - not for lack of trying (music lessons at a young age)... but could never carry a tune or keep rhythm. I suppose its what being dyslexic feels like. If I were educated in a culture where music was fundamentally as important as reading or math, I suppose would have spent enough hours on it to eventually be passable... but I g…

guys I think we're being too hard on this guy, why are we so upset that songeater is now Jimi Hendrix because of Suno? I know I'm jealous, I've been beating on my guitar for decades and I'm still pretty meh, but its because I lack the true creative genius required to type suno.com into my browser, not everyone is cut out to be a literal GUITAR GOD like songeater here. Lets give him the props he deserves for the massive investment of backbreaking labor over the past decades^w years^w weeks^w days^w hours^w halfhourmaybe it took for him to learn pseudo-guitar.
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