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Microsoft has urged its employees on H-1B and H-4 visas to return immediately

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

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Re: Microsoft has urged its employees on H-1B and H-4 visas to return immediately

#181

Post by jacquesm »

jama211 wrote: post #38
jacquesm wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, but it is practical: you can consider your life in the US and what you've built up there as an immigrant pretty much lost or at least hanging by a silken thread that can be capriciously cut at any moment. This all depends on the whims of the dictator. Almost anything is better than that. Remember that the purpose of the Berlin wall was not to keep the West out but to keep the East in . You're at the stage where '…

That will take time and may be good long term advice but is almost useless short term advice - they (and potentially you) should read the room, we’re talking about their immediate urgency. Their comment was pretty insensitive considering that.

I've seen my life upturned a couple of times on short notice, I was merely being very practical, it is you that should 'read the room', in the most immediate sense there is fuck-all that will come out of being frustrated and shouting 'injustice', you need to act because the clock is ticking. Get your money out as fast as you can, try to find a way to give someone power of attorney so you don't end up losing everything over an unpaid bill, start thinking of how to go up from where you are right now rather than back to the way things were because there is no 'back'.

Re: Microsoft has urged its employees on H-1B and H-4 visas to return immediately

#182

Post by thisisit »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #105
jacquesm wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The democracy stopped functioning a while ago, this is just the bills being presented.

Unless you mean the electoral college overriding popular vote nonsense, and disproportionate Senate power, which was there since the beginning, I don't know what you mean. The voters apparently wanted more of this per the Nov 2024 elections, when we still had a credible election process.

I see this point being made a lot.

Lets be clear - the election was won on inflation. While a lot was said about 47th's previous record it was often brushed aside with - Sure, this was said last time too and he didn't do any of this. Its the same thing all over again, people crying wolf etc. There was even consternation about Project 2025 and many well minded people didn't believe it would be enacted.

Now the approval rating on handling of economy continues to fall day by day. Immigration was the strongest suit at +10 is now under water at -4.5.

That means while voters might have wanted something to be done about immigration but they might not wanted more of this. This will become clear only during the midterm elections. With all the efforts being made to gerrymander and gain as many seats as possible, it is good guess to say GOP also realize that people didn't want more of this - and the only way now is to hold on to power by any means necessary.

So, that it allows others to say - This government was elected in Nov 2024 and if they are doing this terrible thing then surely people have voted for this.

Re: Microsoft has urged its employees on H-1B and H-4 visas to return immediately

#183

Post by rayiner »

brador wrote: post #178
rayiner wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re using the term “democracy” in an Orwellian way. The people voted for the guy who promised mass deportations. There were signs and everything. Multiple surveys have found that, if everyone had voted, he would have won by an even larger margin. https://www.npr.org/2025/06/26/nx-s1-5447450/trump-2024-elec... A non-functioning democracy would be if the people voted this way and mass deportations didn’t happen. Lik…

It's Tyranny of the Majority - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyranny_of_the_majority

That describes a perceived problem with democracy that’s addressed through various anti-democratic institutions.

That’s a fine position to have. But be candid that you’re arguing for anti-democratic institutions. It’s the same reasoning why, at the time of the founding, states restricted the franchise to property owners.

Re: Microsoft has urged its employees on H-1B and H-4 visas to return immediately

#185

Post by [deleted] »

thisisit wrote: post #182
lotsofpulp wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless you mean the electoral college overriding popular vote nonsense, and disproportionate Senate power, which was there since the beginning, I don't know what you mean. The voters apparently wanted more of this per the Nov 2024 elections, when we still had a credible election process.

I see this point being made a lot. Lets be clear - the election was won on inflation. While a lot was said about 47th's previous record it was often brushed aside with - Sure, this was said last time too and he didn't do any of this. Its the same thing all over again, people crying wolf etc. There was even consternation about Project 2025 and many well minded people didn't believe it would be enacted. Now the approva…

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft has urged its employees on H-1B and H-4 visas to return immediately

#186

Post by dira3 »

rayiner wrote: post #172
jacquesm wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The democracy stopped functioning a while ago, this is just the bills being presented.

You’re using the term “democracy” in an Orwellian way. The people voted for the guy who promised mass deportations. There were signs and everything. Multiple surveys have found that, if everyone had voted, he would have won by an even larger margin. https://www.npr.org/2025/06/26/nx-s1-5447450/trump-2024-elec... A non-functioning democracy would be if the people voted this way and mass deportations didn’t happen. Lik…

Democracy isn't supposed to be two wolves and a sheep voting on who to eat for dinner. There are supposed to be checks and balances.

One reason we are in the current situation is because we have discarded these checks and balances, allowing for the president to behave more like an autocratic monarch. If the other branches of government were performing their constitutional function, and if the executive observed the norms it's supposed to that's when you would have a democracy not just in letter but in spirit.

(Ironically I myself am an immigrant and a naturalized citizen, yet I find I know more about American civics than most US-born.)

Re: Microsoft has urged its employees on H-1B and H-4 visas to return immediately

#187

Post by rayiner »

dira3 wrote: post #186
rayiner wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re using the term “democracy” in an Orwellian way. The people voted for the guy who promised mass deportations. There were signs and everything. Multiple surveys have found that, if everyone had voted, he would have won by an even larger margin. https://www.npr.org/2025/06/26/nx-s1-5447450/trump-2024-elec... A non-functioning democracy would be if the people voted this way and mass deportations didn’t happen. Lik…

Democracy isn't supposed to be two wolves and a sheep voting on who to eat for dinner. There are supposed to be checks and balances. One reason we are in the current situation is because we have discarded these checks and balances, allowing for the president to behave more like an autocratic monarch. If the other branches of government were performing their constitutional function, and if the executive observed the n…

No, democracy is supposed to be two wolves and a sheep voting on who to eat for dinner. What you’re talking about are the anti-democratic measures the founders put in place because they didn’t trust democracy.

Look, it’s hardly settled that “democracy” is a good thing. The founders didn’t think it was—they restricted the franchise to property owners, and provided for indirect election of the president and appointment of senators by stage legislatures. Just be candid about what you’re arguing, because these distinctions matter. Jacksonian Democracy has a theory of how decisions are legitimized—by the support of the masses. If you believe that the government should sometimes do something different than what the masses want, then you need to articulate a theory for who should make those decisions and what confers legitimacy on those decisions.

Re: Microsoft has urged its employees on H-1B and H-4 visas to return immediately

#188

Post by yodsanklai »

stronglikedan wrote: post #45
tom89999 wrote: post #24

Get your relatives and family out of this shithole and start a new life somewhere else. Why paying taxes for fat crooks? Why working your ass off for major companiel that dont pay taxes? I more and more understand people leaving their home country.

[flagged]

Anyone claiming their country is "the best the world's got" is probably victim of some nationalistic propaganda.

Re: Microsoft has urged its employees on H-1B and H-4 visas to return immediately

#189

Post by Muromec »

rayiner wrote: post #172
jacquesm wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The democracy stopped functioning a while ago, this is just the bills being presented.

You’re using the term “democracy” in an Orwellian way. The people voted for the guy who promised mass deportations. There were signs and everything. Multiple surveys have found that, if everyone had voted, he would have won by an even larger margin. https://www.npr.org/2025/06/26/nx-s1-5447450/trump-2024-elec... A non-functioning democracy would be if the people voted this way and mass deportations didn’t happen. Lik…

When 51% of the eligible voters voters cast their votes to genocide the remaining 49% percent of eligible voters (which is not what happened of course), it doesn't matter whether genocide actually happens or not to determine that it's not in fact a functioning democracy.

It sounds like a contradiction, but it's not, because the critique of a democratic society doesn't have to be limited to a decision process that leads to certain behavior, but both to the problem that triggered it and the solution that the system had produced.

Re: Microsoft has urged its employees on H-1B and H-4 visas to return immediately

#190

Post by thisisit »

0xy wrote: post #68
Muromec wrote: post #20

This is not what functioning bureaucracy in a functioning democracy looks like.

H1Bs are slave labor and the program is used primarily by sweat shop consultancies who pay them less than Americans. This will be incredible for Americans looking for work. They don't have to compete with artificially cheap workers.

As I posted in another thread people seem to be stuck on this point.

Lets agree - some H1B was exploited by sweat shop consultancies who pay less than Americans. And this might be incredible for Americans looking for work.

But in what world does this kind of policy implementation is justified? How is this a functioning bureaucracy in a functioning democracy where people can suffer like this?

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