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US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

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Re: US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

#181

Post by pera »

msgodel wrote: post #177
pera wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to admit I am quite intrigued by your ideology and feelings: it seems that you are acknowledging to hold racist beliefs but at the same time it bothers you to be called racist? May I ask why?

When did I say I'm bothered by being called racist? That sounds like an assumption you've made. The reality is that I get called racist regardless of what I do so I've accepted it.

I guess I misunderstood what you meant here:

> you should have tried to have this conversation with us years ago instead of just calling us racist.

Re: US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

#182

Post by roxolotl »

msgodel wrote: post #173
roxolotl wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you cannot provide evidence which cannot be defined away then yes it’s not a problem. That is generally how problems work.

I can simply define racism to not be a problem and ignore you then.

Except that you can point to deaths, loss of productively, loss of revenue, etc caused by racist attitudes. And you can point to benefits caused by immigration.

I still have yet to hear an answer from my initial question about why any of this is a genuine problem aside from housing which I agree with but disagree on the solution.

To make progress concrete things need to exist for discussion around them to happen.

Re: US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

#183

Post by msgodel »

roxolotl wrote: post #182
msgodel wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can simply define racism to not be a problem and ignore you then.

Except that you can point to deaths, loss of productively, loss of revenue, etc caused by racist attitudes. And you can point to benefits caused by immigration. I still have yet to hear an answer from my initial question about why any of this is a genuine problem aside from housing which I agree with but disagree on the solution. To make progress concrete things need to exist for discussion around them to happen.

Deaths is an odd one to pick considering racial homicide statistics, so there's another problem for you to chew on.

I think the real fundamental problem we're running into is that we don't have a shared set of moral axioms. You've probably chosen international/interracial cooperation as one and I have not.

Re: US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

#184

Post by monkeyfun »

derriz wrote: post #97
gwd wrote: post #13

Haven't these guys heard of the "reciprocity principle"? When I went to Brazil a few years ago, the basic price for a tourist visa was like $25 and could be done online. But, if you were a US citizen, it cost $150 and you had to schedule an attend an interview in person -- because , those were the costs and burdens placed on Brazilian citizens to apply for a US visa. Does the US want other countries inspecting our ci…

In this case, what has Ireland done to US citizens that this reciprocates? Ireland has a special deal for US citizens - no visa is required for visits up to 90 days - you just turn up and show your passport. I'm not convinced that this is truly about actually protecting the US from terrorism or foreign attack since all major terrorist acts that I can recall over the last few decades were perpetrated by native-born US…

You don't seem to have understood their post at all by asking what Ireland did that this is reciprocating. They're saying other countries should reciprocate this upon Americans. The point you make about the purpose from the American pov is valid and correct + clearly meant to be expanded upon or abused in the future, but not their point.

Re: US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

#185

Post by msgodel »

pera wrote: post #181
msgodel wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When did I say I'm bothered by being called racist? That sounds like an assumption you've made. The reality is that I get called racist regardless of what I do so I've accepted it.

I guess I misunderstood what you meant here: > you should have tried to have this conversation with us years ago instead of just calling us racist.

My complaint was the lack of productive conversation, not the name calling.

That is to say "instead of working with us to find a solution you simply dismissed our ideas (by labeling them racist and refusing to think further.)"

Re: US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

#186

Post by potato3732842 »

ujkhsjkdhf234 wrote: post #174
potato3732842 wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I would love to know your state because I can promise your social programs are not degrading because of immigrants and are degrading because of tax cuts to the rich. Run the numbers on the five bluest states. No matter what definition of "bluest" you use you'll get mine in there somewhere. You'll never see the issue unless you actually look at nation of origin stats, which are not collected by much of anybody. These…

I also know people who work in these agencies. I'm not saying these people don't exist. I'm saying these people aren't a "drain" as you put it. They pax taxes towards these programs and pay social security that they can't claim. The problem is happening at a different part of the funnel.

The problem isn't whether they pay taxes. The problem is that we've effectively increased the number of poor people in the country, or at the very least my state, on a whim. And that imperils all the social safety net programs or at the very least degrades them for the populations that they were intentionally envisioned to serve (which also imperils them, but politically instead of financially).

Re: US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

#187

Post by monkeyfun »

ethbr1 wrote: post #140
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d guess this administration draws its power from voters who don’t have a passport and power brokers whose staff handle visas. (Or at least it operates as if it believes it does.)

That any US citizen doesn't have a passport is mind blowing, sad, and also indicative. $18/yr for access to most of the world. Yet people say "No thanks. I'm sure the US is great."

Access that costs thousands of dollars for a short trip that most people simply don't have the spare money for. The median US income is Also, it's not $18/year like a subscription, it's $165 upfront -- money that could be spent on gas, food, medical bills, desperately saved up for emergencies, etc. and won't provide any benefit whatsoever to their lives unless they're taking a vacation they probably don't feel they can afford financially or in their <2 weeks of vacation time.

Re: US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

#188

Post by ujkhsjkdhf234 »

potato3732842 wrote: post #186
ujkhsjkdhf234 wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also know people who work in these agencies. I'm not saying these people don't exist. I'm saying these people aren't a "drain" as you put it. They pax taxes towards these programs and pay social security that they can't claim. The problem is happening at a different part of the funnel.

The problem isn't whether they pay taxes. The problem is that we've effectively increased the number of poor people in the country, or at the very least my state, on a whim. And that imperils all the social safety net programs or at the very least degrades them for the populations that they were intentionally envisioned to serve (which also imperils them, but politically instead of financially).

You've misunderstood my point with mentioning that they pax taxes. If more people are paying taxes then more money should be flowing into these programs, doubly so if more people are using them. If that isn't happening then your problem is with funding.

Re: US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

#189

Post by HWR_14 »

derriz wrote: post #97
gwd wrote: post #13

Haven't these guys heard of the "reciprocity principle"? When I went to Brazil a few years ago, the basic price for a tourist visa was like $25 and could be done online. But, if you were a US citizen, it cost $150 and you had to schedule an attend an interview in person -- because , those were the costs and burdens placed on Brazilian citizens to apply for a US visa. Does the US want other countries inspecting our ci…

In this case, what has Ireland done to US citizens that this reciprocates? Ireland has a special deal for US citizens - no visa is required for visits up to 90 days - you just turn up and show your passport. I'm not convinced that this is truly about actually protecting the US from terrorism or foreign attack since all major terrorist acts that I can recall over the last few decades were perpetrated by native-born US…

9/11, which most people would put in the past few decades and a major terrorist act, was exclusively done by people on visas.

Meanwhile, I think the post you are responding to was pointing out that other countries are likely to reciprocate similar rules for US visitors to their countries.

Re: US embassy wants 'every social media username of past five years' for new visas

#190

Post by OkayPhysicist »

ethbr1 wrote: post #140
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d guess this administration draws its power from voters who don’t have a passport and power brokers whose staff handle visas. (Or at least it operates as if it believes it does.)

That any US citizen doesn't have a passport is mind blowing, sad, and also indicative. $18/yr for access to most of the world. Yet people say "No thanks. I'm sure the US is great."

For all but a tiny fraction of Americans, the cost of a passport is a tiny, rounding error expense compared to actually leaving the country. This isn't Europe, where you take a wrong turn and end up in a different country. Here in California, there's a highway you can drive on for 750 miles and not even have left the state (like driving from Paris to Warsaw). And we're just one state of 50. On the diagonal, crossing the continental US is like driving from London to Tel-Aviv.

Nearby, we've got Canada and Mexico, and up until pretty recently, you could cross over those borders with a driver's license. And both those countries are big. On the other sides we have oceans. So for most Americans, the minimum cost of an international flight is the same as the cost for a European to fly to the US ($500-$1000), and a full day's travel each way. Here on HN, we might forget that most of the population makes fucking peanuts, so keep in mind that means that for most Americans, $1000 is a lot of money. Most Americans also don't get a lot of time off, so those 2 days of travel are a significant cost in of themselves.

All told, the lack of passports amongst Americans isn't indicative of some isolationist mindset. It's just that they have no need of a passport, because they aren't taking the kinds of extremely far-flung vacations that would need one, and they know if they need one, they can just get one before their trip.

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