181–190 of 300 posts
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Sorry to hear that, I wouldn't bet anything on Apple but the core language contains a lot of good ideas imho.
Seems lovely but headed in a Scala-like bloated direction. The "too complex" type issues were really bad last I tried. And one of my biggest gripes is the way you can extend things from anywhere else, easy to cause a mess.
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> people familiar with macos or ios development who want to write for other platforms. This is a rather small userbase when it comes to enterprise. Especially because Swift will never be as versatile as Python or as efficient as Rust. And then there's also Go, C# and Kotlin with much better tooling.
Xcode gives me such a hard time that I started considering writing in Kotlin for macOS, just to have a normal IDE. We used to have AppCode (from JetBrains) and it was great. I wonder why Apple didn't support JetBrains, after all, it would have been to Apple's benefit.
Me not liking something, does not make it bad. It’s just not my choice. I’m glad it existed, because it probably prompted Apple to do better with Xcode. Lots of people that I respect, used it.
These days, Xcode is Big Bug Ranch. When “Delete the DerivedData folder” is S. O. P. for developers, and Apple tweaked Xcode to reduce its impact on the project, you know that they have waved a white flag to bugs.
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If you want to use Visual Studio Code the 'DevKit' extension which provides essential features (language server) is proprietary and requires a Visual Studio licence regardless of platform. Also I find since C# is an 'enterprise' language developers take the p--s in what they want to charge for, as enterprise will pay as a 'cost of doing business'. Recently FluentAssertions, a freakin test assertion library decided th…
DevKit is completely optional. The language server is part of the SDK itself. The language server integration, debugger and all the features that make VS Code a good tool to write C# in are a part of base C# extension which is MIT-licensed and has no commercial restrictions whatsoever. The only "wart" is that "vsdbg" - debugger it ships with is closed-source because it is essentially the same debugger as in Visual St…
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Sorry to hear that, I wouldn't bet anything on Apple but the core language contains a lot of good ideas imho.
Seems lovely but headed in a Scala-like bloated direction. The "too complex" type issues were really bad last I tried. And one of my biggest gripes is the way you can extend things from anywhere else, easy to cause a mess.
But it is a shame, because many of the ideas are good imho.
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> Kotlin’s syntax is also weird/quirky in some ways. I'm curious to learn what you mean by this! :)
No terenary if and the elvis operator, for one. Stuff like that trips me up frequently when jumping between Kotlin and Swift/other C-likes.
Swift itself is a great piece of tech. But it is doomed to fail as a general widely adopted language unless apple makes few critical moves including open sourcing everything including XCode, providing support for 3d party IDE developers (because xcode is terrible), creating decent package manager, adopting testing as first class citizen etc. There is just no economical sense for anyone to invest in swift until all th…
The path they've chosen is not to open source Xcode, but to move the things Swift needs on all platforms to the Swift language project and common implementations.
Personally I think the main problem with the language, besides Apple's earned poor reputation in FOSS circles, is the compile times. In the source-stable era of the language I'm not sure how they can really be fixed to the degree I'd be happy with.
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> Their business decisions have driven most developers away from the App Store. > They don't have an easy way to run untrusted software in a containerized way (compare Fedora toolbox). The App Store is the way to run untrusted apps in a containerized way.
It's "the way" that apple wanted it to be, but it's not the way that humans have chosen. Typically not a great idea to be against humans, especially the ones that give you money.
Last time I checked, their market cap was North of $3T, so someone is giving them money…
Is Swift actually serious about embedded?
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I don't get this reaction. Apple: here, we're open-sourcing this previously closed-source Apple-specific thing that made Swift better on Apple platforms. We're moving the Apple stuff into a plugin so Windows and Linux can be equal peers to Apple in the new system. We've implemented preliminary support for Windows & Linux and plan to continue work to bring them up to parity. Hacker News: I believe that this long game…
> Like, what more do you want from them? You know what we want from them. If Apple wants to be accepted by the Open Source community, they can't reprise the Microsoft playbook with a smug "Think Different" twist. This is basically a beat-for-beat rerun of the C#/Dotnet situation with a different font and Corinthian leather. The internet at-large is sick and tired of tending to Apple's scraps at their obscure whims. I…
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I don't get this reaction. Apple: here, we're open-sourcing this previously closed-source Apple-specific thing that made Swift better on Apple platforms. We're moving the Apple stuff into a plugin so Windows and Linux can be equal peers to Apple in the new system. We've implemented preliminary support for Windows & Linux and plan to continue work to bring them up to parity. Hacker News: I believe that this long game…
They should have been fully open source with full linux support and parity since day one. That would actually help the language get traction. At this point it's a dying language.