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What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

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Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#181

Post by akira2501 »

actionfromafar wrote: post #154
akira2501 wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen people do this but I think it's unlikely. The weight on an ICE car is slung much differently from an EV and placing a battery bank where your engine used to be is not a great idea.

I may be daft but it seems like a great idea. Same weight and everything. In France you get a decent subsidy if you convert your ICE to EV.

Your engine is part of your crumple zone. You do not want your battery to be. Same reason the fuel tank is usually in the back of the vehicle.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#182

Post by hnlmorg »

BigGreenJorts wrote: post #177
hnlmorg wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And an EV without smarts is legitimately just a golf cart. Not really no. There’s a gulf of difference between a car and a golf buggy. And we can prove that by turning your argument the other way and saying: if that were true then ICE vehicles would just be petrol-powered golf carts. Clearly that isn’t even a remotely accurate way of describing your average car

I mean, besides shape and speed, what is the difference that most people are concerned about. I wasn't aware that golf carts are all electric. I just thought of a golf cart as a car used specifically to traverse golf courses and resorts.

Shape, speed, comfort (better seating), body work, windscreen, lights, gears, radio, air conditioning… I could go on

If people just wanted to drive around in vehicles that were equivalent to golf carts then everyone would own a quad bike instead of a car.

Cars have been around for more than a hundreds years so it’s astonishing to me that some people cannot imagine what a car would look like without the “smart” features

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#183

Post by spockz »

madaxe_again wrote: post #125
skinkestek wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In Europe, it’s also common for you to buy a place, and then when you move in, you find the vendor has taken all of the wiring and plumbing with them. This is the first time I hwar of this. At least in Norway the rule is that everything that is built in stays. So table, chairs, TV, washing machine, dryer etc goes, but built in appliances and built in place furniture stays.

Yeah, from what I understand this is not the norm in the Nordic states, but it is elsewhere.

It’s the same in the Netherlands with the very odd exception for floors. Solid wooden floors are included but if it “laminaat” or anything not glued/nailed, it has to be explicitly mentioned in the sale contract. Just like with window shades etc.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#184

Post by elzbardico »

madaxe_again wrote: post #130
tomrod wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a super dumb outcome for your poor mother. Abandoned property is just that.

In France it’s only counted as abandoned if it is more than 30 years. These guys rocked up at something like 29 years and 9 months, and because there had been a verbal agreement that they would one day collect, and my mother allowed it, she was deemed to have stolen property she was entrusted to store. She was actually lucky to avoid criminal charges.

I really think she should counter-sue for storage fees and damages.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#185

Post by quailfarmer »

Etheryte wrote: post #155
quailfarmer wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They’re not black boxes, you’re just not an electrical engineer. They’re actually way simpler than ICE in a bunch of ways that really improve reliability. We just need to develop a collective understanding of how electric drivetrains work, the kind of understanding that we had developed in previous generations for ICE cars

This is a funny comment because that's almost exactly what I have a degree in. The point here isn't the engine though, even though those are also a separate beast, but rather that all of these vehicles are packed to the brim with a bunch of chips with internet access and you have no idea what's really running on them. With electric cars we're seeing even more of this than with ICEs.

Sorry, a quip in bad faith. Collectively, _we_ (would-be car maintenance people) are not well enough versed in how these types of systems are designed. This is a collective failure, lack of documentation.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#186

Post by cipheredStones »

afh1 wrote: post #25

The scary part is not the GPS installed by the fleet company that previously owned the car, which in all likelihood was just forgotten there, but the GPS and eSIM that comes with most (all?) new cars and that in most (all?) new cars cannot be disabled. Apart from privacy concerns of your data being used or sold by the car vendor, government outreach is also a concern. There was a bill announced in the US for all new…

> Media rushed to say it's not really a kill switch, just "sensors or cameras to monitor the driver’s behaviors, head or eye movements" and "block the driver from operating the vehicle". So... a kill switch.

You're selectively quoting in a way that misrepresents the article.

The post the article quotes:

> “Joe Biden signed a bill that would give law enforcement access to a ‘kill switch’ that will be attached to ALL new cars in 2026,” read several posts shared widely on Twitter and Facebook.

The actual functionality:

> In either case, if a driver is found to be impaired [by automated monitoring within the car], the car might employ a warning message, block the driver from operating the vehicle, or if the vehicle is already in motion, direct it to a safe stop or automated ride home.

> None of the technologies currently in development would notify law enforcement of the data collected inside vehicles or give government agencies remote control of vehicles, according to Jeffrey Michael, a researcher at Johns Hopkins University’s Center for Injury Research and Policy.

The car has an automatic system which can prevent the driver from operating it, but no one outside the car can trigger that system, which is clearly what the "kill switch" posts were claiming.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#187

Post by dylan604 »

6SixTy wrote: post #142
dylan604 wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> likely powered 24/7, This is a weird thing to call out. I'd suggest a car is powered as much as a phone. I'm trying to decide for people that have a car and a phone which is more infuriating to not have power.

Kill switches across the battery aren't terribly uncommon

That’s your retort? Do you have numbers of them being anything more than a rounding error? More and more cars need something reset when the battery is disconnected. I can only assume that this will become even more prevalent as a “security feature”. I had after market head unit that used that as an anti-theft deterrent.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#188

Post by rcpt »

skinkestek wrote: post #103
rcpt wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're right. Because my e-bike is of negligible danger to others. But cars kill tens of thousands every year. Speed limits and red lights being on the honor system isn't working. Luckily technology, like the little GPS tracker in the article, can fix it.

Most things that transfer power from individuals to future governments is a clear no from me. I am happy with our current government. But reading history I have realized that the scariest thing that is is powerful governments. Honor and trust work extremely well: anyone of us can create enormous caos if we want to but most of us don't so it doesn't happen.

I don't like that my kids can no longer cross the street we live on because people have stopped obeying traffic lights and cops no longer enforce the law. The honor system isn't working and people are dying because of it.

Now what are your specific fears about speed limiters on cars?

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#189

Post by rcpt »

justinclift wrote: post #107
rcpt wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're right. Because my e-bike is of negligible danger to others. But cars kill tens of thousands every year. Speed limits and red lights being on the honor system isn't working. Luckily technology, like the little GPS tracker in the article, can fix it.

Pity about the downsides of the technologies you mention though. :(

What downside?

You're not supposed to run red lights or exceed the speed limit. This should be enforced electronically. The machines are unbiased and more accurate than cops. Cheaper too.

Re: What does this button do? – My new car has a mysterious and undocumented switch

#190

Post by adamsb6 »

cipheredStones wrote: post #186
afh1 wrote: post #25

The scary part is not the GPS installed by the fleet company that previously owned the car, which in all likelihood was just forgotten there, but the GPS and eSIM that comes with most (all?) new cars and that in most (all?) new cars cannot be disabled. Apart from privacy concerns of your data being used or sold by the car vendor, government outreach is also a concern. There was a bill announced in the US for all new…

> Media rushed to say it's not really a kill switch, just "sensors or cameras to monitor the driver’s behaviors, head or eye movements" and "block the driver from operating the vehicle". So... a kill switch. You're selectively quoting in a way that misrepresents the article. The post the article quotes: > “Joe Biden signed a bill that would give law enforcement access to a ‘kill switch’ that will be attached to ALL n…

If it’s not air gapped the company could be compelled to activate it remotely.
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