Live data from Hacker News

Nvidia and its partners built a system to bypass U.S. export restrictions

twitter.com

181–190 of 229 posts

Re: Nvidia and its partners built a system to bypass U.S. export restrictions

#181
post #119

Nvidia is obviously a US company, but the chips themselves are manufactured in Taiwan. And of course China sees Taiwan as a rogue province, at at least treats invasion there as "on the table". While the US may decide to actively support Taiwan, at the very least a war over that will disrupt production. Should Taiwan fall, and China choose to ban exports from there to the US, then the fun and games would really start.…

In the event of a invasion TMSC in Taiwan will cease to function. "TMSC and its Dutch chip machine supplier ASML have made joint plans to remotely disable the machines in the event of an invasion." https://9to5mac.com/2024/05/21/chinese-invasion-of-taiwan-ts...

In 2022 TSMC Chairman Mark Liu appeared in a rare interview with CNN’s Fareed Zakariya.In the interview, Liu categorically says that if China were to take over Taiwan, it would find TSMC’s facilities unusable because their secret ingredient is human capital and real-time international collaboration with companies for materials, software, hardware, and know-how.

Part 1: https://edition.cnn.com/videos/tv/2022/07/31/exp-731-taiwan-... Part 2: https://edition.cnn.com/videos/tv/2022/07/31/exp-gps-0731-ma...

Re: Nvidia and its partners built a system to bypass U.S. export restrictions

#182

Nvidia is obviously a US company, but the chips themselves are manufactured in Taiwan. And of course China sees Taiwan as a rogue province, at at least treats invasion there as "on the table". While the US may decide to actively support Taiwan, at the very least a war over that will disrupt production. Should Taiwan fall, and China choose to ban exports from there to the US, then the fun and games would really start.…

[deleted]

Re: Nvidia and its partners built a system to bypass U.S. export restrictions

#183
post #72

Nvidia is obviously a US company, but the chips themselves are manufactured in Taiwan. And of course China sees Taiwan as a rogue province, at at least treats invasion there as "on the table". While the US may decide to actively support Taiwan, at the very least a war over that will disrupt production. Should Taiwan fall, and China choose to ban exports from there to the US, then the fun and games would really start.…

> Should Taiwan fall, and China choose to ban exports Are there any "exports" to ban after the fall? The TSMC production was interrupted by a metro passing by few kilometers away. How can it sustain in a war?

Isn't Taiwan in a heavy earthquake zone, the Ring of Fire? Does that not affect the factories more than a subway passing several kilometers away?

Re: Nvidia and its partners built a system to bypass U.S. export restrictions

#184

Nvidia is obviously a US company, but the chips themselves are manufactured in Taiwan. And of course China sees Taiwan as a rogue province, at at least treats invasion there as "on the table". While the US may decide to actively support Taiwan, at the very least a war over that will disrupt production. Should Taiwan fall, and China choose to ban exports from there to the US, then the fun and games would really start.…

China is no longer afraid that the US will back Taiwan. Last year Biden threatened Iran with "don't", and Iran "did", and the US did absolutely nothing. Biden has demonstrated that US security promises to allies mean nothing, not do even direct US threats, extremely expensive Navy not withstanding. After Biden's responses to both Russian and Iranian aggression, do you think that China has any concerns anymore?

To the deleted or missing comment: This is the video of Biden stressing "don't".

https://youtube.com/watch?v=aWFefjhPtQk

By not responding, Biden has undermined decades of US deterrence value.

Re: Nvidia and its partners built a system to bypass U.S. export restrictions

#185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The ban exists as good politics (we don't ship to our adversaries) Do normal people really view china as an adversary? I see this constantly being pushed by politicians and pundits but, unlike other countries in my lifetime, I don't really see that much animosity from normal folk. Expats who resent the PRC? Absolutely. Racism? Definitely. But there's not much appetite for the demonization of our largest trade partn…

Not sure why you're getting downvotes, it's a legitimate question. There are different kinds of adversary. A traditional tactic in politics is to find someone to blame. Trump blames immigrants, Muslims and China. He translated this into economic action by putting tarrifs on Chinese goods. (Tarrifs are a terrible idea, but one of the few things the president can do unilaterally.) Thanks to his years of anti-chinese rh…

>Thanks to his years of anti-chinese rhetoric, I think there's a substantial number of people who gave drunk that kool-aid and see China as adversarial.

Trump did the right thing for the wrong reasons. It's not a "substantial number", it's the bi-partisan consensus across both parties.

I find that the people who downplay the threat of China tend to rely on arguments of isolationism and assured implicit continuity of the values of the liberal international order, that they can continue to remain naval gazing at problems at home rather than realizing the world has changed.

As the Chinese themselves argue, it's a "multipolar" world order. Their explicit ideological commitment to Schmittian realism, the rejection of hetegenerous plurality is a direct acknowledgment of fundamentally adversarial nature that governs the relationship between groups. That's what Wang Huning is saying, that's what they're talking about in Zhihu and Weibo. To reject that China is an adversary is to paradoxically deny what the Chinese (and much of the rest of the world) believes in favour of a overly myopic Eurocentric view.

The ironic thing is that the CCP's reaction to American liberalism isn't wholly different from Trump or Thiel's postliberalism, really just different flavors of either Han or Christian neoconservatism.

Re: Nvidia and its partners built a system to bypass U.S. export restrictions

#186
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what you're saying is that the lesson of appeasing Hitler was all in vain.

What about the lesson of not 'appeasing' the Weimar Republic?

But Hu Jintao and Jiang Zemin were appeased, big time.

Re: Nvidia and its partners built a system to bypass U.S. export restrictions

#187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the perspective of a third party and trying to understand things in a way that separates politics from reality (like PG says arguments involving identity are impossible to resolve), both Taiwanese and what might be called CCP-ese are largely political. Chinese has the rare quality of historically referring to ethnicity, language and culture to a degree not seen in most other peoples. There's also a final and mos…

> ethnically, linguistically and culturally Chinese Again I ask - where is this impression coming from? And for what definition of "Chinese?" Can you please write the specific term you're thinking of in Mandarin to be more clear? In English "Chinese" means too many things, especially with the CPC changing the definition over the last 50 years or so. To be fair, the same thing is happening in Mandarin, so it would hel…

The impression and definition come from anthropology and history. In this case Chinese means 中华 and there's the Chinese language, race, and culture or 华文, 汉族, 中华文化. I apologise if I don't grasp some nuance from the words in Chinese I chose but from an objective, historical point of view, these terms are consistent. The lineage and changes (or lack of changes) of these has been established with varying levels of definitiveness.

The most definitive is the ancestry Han. DNA tracing has established the genetic continuity of a Han race going back thousands of years, with an extremely homogeneous genetic profile between members of the race. 95% of the population of China and Taiwan belong to this race, with a 5% of minorities.

Next most definitive is the language. The modern form of what is called regular script (I am unsure if what it is called in Chinese but it is traditional Chinese today), was the predominant form since about 250 AD. Certain words have become archaic and literary allusions might be lost. And aside from the changes in word order, you could read texts from this period onwards (with some difficulty). The governments of China all used this script, with certain governments also using additional languages like Manchu. The way it was spoken did vary a lot even till today, but there definitely is the Chinese language that both Taiwan and China uses. The fact that people from these countries can converse in their native tongue is basic empirical proof you speak the same language.

Culture is the least definitive concept, but it's very plain you have a shared culture. It's not exactly the same (and culture varies within a country too) but historically it is very clear it comes from the same culture. Frankly it's quite a basic fact that the people on Taiwan and China have historically been part of same people.

I'd like to emphasize what the CCP says does not change anything about the history and anthropology of it. I'd I'm being blunt, both what might be called the "CCP Han identity" and "Taiwanese identity" are political movements. In the case of the CCP to associate themselves with the history of China (which has swung wildly given their behavior especially during the cultural revolution) and in the case of Taiwanese identity (which has intensified in recent decades because of the geopolitical situation).

Re: Nvidia and its partners built a system to bypass U.S. export restrictions

#188
post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ethnically, linguistically and culturally Chinese Again I ask - where is this impression coming from? And for what definition of "Chinese?" Can you please write the specific term you're thinking of in Mandarin to be more clear? In English "Chinese" means too many things, especially with the CPC changing the definition over the last 50 years or so. To be fair, the same thing is happening in Mandarin, so it would hel…

> Second of all, Taiwan is not ethnically or culturally "Chinese" for basically all definitions of "Chinese." That's factually wrong. Most of the country is populated by Chinese (speaking a variety of Sinitic languages, namely Min, Mandarin and Hakka). The non-Chinese population are the aboriginals and foreigners.

Ok, will you please then define "Chinese?"

Re: Nvidia and its partners built a system to bypass U.S. export restrictions

#190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But Hu Jintao and Jiang Zemin were appeased, big time.

Hopefully it worked?

Of course it didn't. A dictatorship country with the greatest population on Earth was given everything it needed to become the greatest industrial power and hold everyone else to ransom. The earlier the West divests from China entirely, the better, preferably few decades ago.
Post reply on HN