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So thieves broke into your storage unit again

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Re: So thieves broke into your storage unit again

#181

Post by dimensi0nal »

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #161
_dain_ wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The US already incarcerates vastly more people than most comparable nations because it has vastly more crime than comparable nations. you have to look at what happens to crime in the US over time, when you are more or less stringent about jailing criminals; predictably as you fill the jails, crime goes down, and when you empty them, crimes goes up. >It seems that you imagine that the crime is somehow intrinsic to th…

we incarcerate at a higher rate per capita, not just in absolute numbers. based on your apparent view of things, that ought to result in less crime per capita, but it does not. > more or less stringent about jailing criminals is quite different than "fill the jails, empty the jails" Quite a bit of research on the effect of deterrence on crime seems to strongly suggest that it is the level of certainty of being caught…

The comment you replied to is talking about incapacitation, not deterrence.

Re: So thieves broke into your storage unit again

#182

Post by snozolli »

maxbond wrote: post #150
bko wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's only so many people that are criminally predisposed. The org doing bike thefts will stop if the penalty is high enough. Singapore has low crime because they prosecute aggressively. No one seemed to fill in for arrested gang members in El Salvador (extreme example) Then there are the crazy person punching an Asian lady on the subway crimes and these fall squarely in 1

You've blinded yourself by othering them. "There's only so many people criminally predisposed" - that may be comforting, but it's too naive to build a policy around. 100% of people would commit crimes under the right circumstances. As an extreme example, 100% of us could sustain a life changing head injury that renders us more violent and aggressive than we were before, and that could happen at any moment. The most k…

100% of us could sustain a life changing head injury that renders us more violent and aggressive than we were before, and that could happen at any moment

Then I should be imprisoned if I present a threat to the public. I don't understand what your point is.

Re: So thieves broke into your storage unit again

#183

Post by dpifke »

crazygringo wrote: post #173
toast0 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you don't have space in your apartment or home for items you want to keep, then where else are you supposed to store things? On ebay? Sell the stuff now, buy it again if you need it. Doesn't work for everything, of course, and I don't practice it, I've got tons of space and tons of clutter.

So you're going to sell your surfboard and buy new ski equipment every winter, and sell your skis and buy a new surfboard every summer? As well as the rest of your bulky seasonal gear? Sounds expensive.

Not to mention the time value of haggling on Ebay, dealing with scammers, etc.

Re: So thieves broke into your storage unit again

#184

Post by samatman »

immibis wrote: post #134
samatman wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Theft is an organized crime. That tweaker/junkie who steals your bike, breaks into your storage unit, whatever? He's not an organization man. The dude with a standing offer to pay twenty bucks for the bike, or ten if it's shitty? He's with an organization. What I propose is that we start enforcing the law and treat theft as a crime, not a nuisance or fact of life. Roll up the organizations, toss them in prison, and r…

[flagged]

This comment is manifestly made in bad faith.

I want the police to arrest, and DAs to prosecute, organized theft rings. Someone with several stolen bicycles is not a small businessman, he's a fence, and should do several years of time.

It is in fact quite easy to tell that person apart from the guy who bought a bike on Craigslist and oops, turned out it was stolen.

You're pretending this distinction is unclear to you, and insinuating that I'm proposing Soviet price controls. In reality, you are perfectly aware of the distinction and know that I'm not. That is arguing in bad faith.

Re: So thieves broke into your storage unit again

#185

Post by crazygringo »

dpifke wrote: post #183
crazygringo wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you're going to sell your surfboard and buy new ski equipment every winter, and sell your skis and buy a new surfboard every summer? As well as the rest of your bulky seasonal gear? Sounds expensive.

Not to mention the time value of haggling on Ebay, dealing with scammers, etc.

And wasting all that money on shipping and sales tax with each transaction.

Because yes, you have to pay sales tax on eBay, even for used items that already had sales tax paid on their original retail purchase.

Re: So thieves broke into your storage unit again

#186

Post by maxbond »

snozolli wrote: post #182
maxbond wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've blinded yourself by othering them. "There's only so many people criminally predisposed" - that may be comforting, but it's too naive to build a policy around. 100% of people would commit crimes under the right circumstances. As an extreme example, 100% of us could sustain a life changing head injury that renders us more violent and aggressive than we were before, and that could happen at any moment. The most k…

100% of us could sustain a life changing head injury that renders us more violent and aggressive than we were before, and that could happen at any moment Then I should be imprisoned if I present a threat to the public. I don't understand what your point is.

If you think that there is a distinct group of people who commit all the crimes (as was suggested), and we can solve the problem of crime by locking all of them up, than you are mistaken. Or rather, that group is "everyone."

It's an easy trap to fall into for two reasons. It would appear that you and those you know aren't capable of being criminals. This is more comforting than it is true. Everyone, including good people, has the potential to do something horrible; the problem of evil isn't that it's present in a certain group who we can imprison, the problem is that it's present in us all.

The second thing which makes "lock them all up" a seductive proposal is that it's cynical. Cynicism can feel like the opposite of naivete, so it can feel like you're being clear eyed and realistic about the situation and that the people you disagree with (say, prison abolitionists) are naive bleeding hearts. But cynicism is actually just another form of naivete. It's making the same error - blinking while staring into the abyss - with different aesthetics.

Re: So thieves broke into your storage unit again

#187

Post by tshaddox »

istjohn wrote: post #159

The storage unit industry is one of the most awful, customer hostile industries I've encountered. It's impossible to get the local facility on the phone, publicly listed phone numbers are all redirected to a national call center where reps are unable to even accurately quote prices. TFA covers the insurance kickback scam. Then after I moved into my unit, I discovered 75% of the units in my facility could be broken in…

> The paradox is that the monthly cost of a unit will quickly exceed the value of whatever is stored there unless the items have sentimental value or are very expensive.

This is a tough one to manage psychologically, although it’s almost certainly also true of nearly anything you are storing in your own home. The difference of course is that home space is bundled inflexibly—you usually don’t have the option of paying 2% less for 2% less space.

Re: So thieves broke into your storage unit again

#188

Post by Simon_ORourke »

My ex-wife demanded that we store some awful, terrible wicker furniture after a house move, so I put these cheap monstrosities into a $40/month storage unit in a semi-desolate area of town. The unit was broken into three or four times but the thieves didn't do me the favor of actually stealing anything. On the last break in I contemplated just leaving them a note with $20 inside pleading with them to just take the damned things.

Re: So thieves broke into your storage unit again

#189

Post by clcaev »

crazygringo wrote: post #172
PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a periodic public service announcement that there is not, and never has been "a tragedy of the commons situation". Even the author of the concept, Garret Hardin, has acknowledged that he made mistakes in his understanding and research. Resources held in common have historically been subject to significant control via social, civic and legalistic processes. What is typically referred to as "a tragedy of the co…

Can you elaborate? My understanding is that overfishing and climate change are prime and valid examples of the tragedy of the commons. You seem to be claiming that the problem is with systems of management, but the entire point of the tragedy of the commons is that it happens when there isn't management. Which is abundantly the case at the global level of international waters and a shared atmosphere, because there is…

The planet's air and international waters are truly public resources, at least currently. I'm not sure if I would call them a commons.

Speaking of which, Elinor Ostrom's book, Governing the Commons, outlines the conditions for the successful management of a commons. Notably neither private ownership nor governmental control is ideal, the best outcomes are by cooperative organizations where those with a direct stake in the commons are the managers.

Re: So thieves broke into your storage unit again

#190

Post by kevinventullo »

tightbookkeeper wrote: post #164
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #153

The key takeaway I think people are overlooking is that there’s a level of intelligence and persistence in thieves that make physical security an intractable problem with exponential cost scaling as you patch “holes.” So from a systems approach, the better solution likely is something like: Employ and provide safety for the people stealing from the units so they do not feel compelled to steal. Imagine if the money sp…

You’re partly conceding that this level of corrupting and mistrust is just what we have to live with. It has not always been this way though. Side note. If I also accept it this is why cryptocurrency being able to reduce the cost of securing a transaction is still interesting to me. When you use a bank you don’t see the army of night guards, vaults, auditors, and IT people keeping it safe.

On the other hand, I hear a lot more about crypto wallets getting hacked than I do checking accounts at large banks.
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