Live data from Hacker News

EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

patrick-breyer.de

181–190 of 330 posts

Re: EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

#181
post #176
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that we have to deal with this bullshit every couple months is a pretty depressing fact on its own.

I wish there was a way for EU citizens to punish the council this behaviour. Sadly, there doesn't seem to be anything in place for that.

There is: stop electing the people that make these decisions in positions that can land them in the EU Council.

Re: EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

#182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The median EU citizen is not getting poorer relative to the median US citizen. Don't confuse growing income inequality with "national wealth".

GDP per capita of EU used to be higher than the US.

And then poorer countries joined the EU. I'm not an economist but I think that's how it's supposed to work.

Re: EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

#183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Germans by-and-large even refuse to use debit cards (pin&chip) I’d call that a minority, especially since Covid. > not being able to pay with my card in a restaurant for example An even smaller minority, especially for restaurants, slightly larger for non-chain fast food places that probably also cheat on taxes. I don’t carry cash with me and pay almost everything with my MC debit or AMEX credit card, even in cases…

>>An even smaller minority, especially for restaurants, slightly larger for non-chain fast food places that probably also cheat on taxes. Personal anecdote, but I've been travelling through Germany this winter and outside of motorway petrol stations and big supermarkets pretty much no one would accept my Visa/MasterCard cards - "EC Karten" only everywhere. We went to a big restaurant which I assumed would be ok becau…

Weird, I wonder if that’s the south? Up here in Lübeck, even the small stores now almost always accept everything thanks to the small SumUp terminals.

Re: EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

#184
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, if your definition of "collective control over the means of production" is as broad as "there exists a governing body which creates and enforces policies which regulate the private sector", then I guess literally every single modern nation state style society is "socialist" in your eyes. I must say that's not the most useful definition, and certainly not what anyone who's a proponent of anything they call "social…

Like "left/right", it's always a question of degree. There is no pure version of any system. I was responding to a comment that seems to think the EU policies have not a trace of socialism in them, which is incorrect. Edit: and the extent of EU regulations is quite enormous.

No, you are incorrect. There is nothing socialist about the EU. Production, distribution and exchange are not owned by the people. Elected bodies owning them is not socialist.

Re: EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

#185
post #176
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that we have to deal with this bullshit every couple months is a pretty depressing fact on its own.

I wish there was a way for EU citizens to punish the council this behaviour. Sadly, there doesn't seem to be anything in place for that.

Replace your national government during national elections.

Re: EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

#186

The "EU" is not "greenlighting" that proposal this week. The Council of the EU will vote on their negotiation stance, which is merely one step in the legislative process, after which the Commission (which is pro-scanning) and the parliament (which is broadly against it) will get involved.

Technically the commission came first, after this vote it'll go to parliament and then if there's a need for mediation the commission will be involved together with parliament and council

Re: EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

#187

The problem with the current state of the EU is that it is governed by unelected politicians - the EU Comission, and they are very out of touch with reality. Plus the fact they managed to make themselves very hard to control or remove from power. Latest example being farmers that are being targeted and until they did not come to Brussels to dump manure in the streets, the EU Comission did not care a bit of the harm t…

In this specific example it's not the Commission that drives this initiative, but the Council, which is formed of head of states for the individual members.

Re: EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

#188

"Only non-commercial services that are not ad-funded, such as many open source software, are out of scope" So, what's the use of this law anyway? I do wonder what open source means though. Is Signal opensource? The client is, the server is not... Matrix is fully open source... And Whatsapp (which my country runs on) which has open source encryption...?

So I can set up a server for my family and do no scanning, and that's not illegal. Can I let my neighbour join. How far down the street am I allowed to offer this service before it becomes in scope? Can I make a preconfigured, plug-and-play appliance that runs an encrypted chat server on a home internet connection and give that to someone I know? Someone I don't know?

This is one of those extremely frustrating laws that's just going to hit everyone EXCEPT the ones who deserve it.

Re: EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

#189

The "EU" is not "greenlighting" that proposal this week. The Council of the EU will vote on their negotiation stance, which is merely one step in the legislative process, after which the Commission (which is pro-scanning) and the parliament (which is broadly against it) will get involved.

For context for non EU people: > As the commission is the executive branch, candidates are chosen individually by the 27 national governments. Within the EU, the legitimacy of the commission is mainly drawn from the vote of approval that is required from the European Parliament, along with its power to dismiss the body. So, the part of the EU appointed by member governments is the part driving this. The EU (as often)…

Not really

The member states are as much a part of the EU as the parliament is.

It's disingenuous to say that this is not the EU, of course it's also disingenuous to say that the EU is a monolith who wants this at all levels, but two wrongs don't make a right

Re: EU Council to Vote on Chat Scanning Proposal on Thursday

#190

The "EU" is not "greenlighting" that proposal this week. The Council of the EU will vote on their negotiation stance, which is merely one step in the legislative process, after which the Commission (which is pro-scanning) and the parliament (which is broadly against it) will get involved.

It is still possible to contact your EU permanent representative group via email. Op link in "what to do" section has a precompiled email which you can send to your permanent representation group.

As little as it may be, I sent it to the Italian representative group, to the team that oversees telecommunications

Edit if you're Italian you can find the email(s) here, scroll to trasporti e telecomunicazioni https://italiaue.esteri.it/it/chi-siamo/

Post reply on HN