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I continue to no longer attend vintage computer festivals

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Re: I continue to no longer attend vintage computer festivals

#181
post #4

Why would you take all this stuff only to toss it all out? Though to he fair, it seems the person that took it was pushed out and replaced? In which case, why, if you do not take this stuff, would you work for a VCF?

Perhaps the policy changed. Storing stuff takes space and effort. Cataloging even more so. Making it available to others is a jump in magnitude. Eventually, it can become untenable. Organizations like this tend to not lack donors. What they lack is the capacity to cope with donations. Time, labor, space, money are all finite, regardless of their mission. Even the Salvation Army will refuse things like furniture. It’s…

Yeah. The reality is that your old computer gear, computer software, or magazines will probably just end up with someone else who is something of a packrat about such things. They'll get some momentary pleasure out of it, it will end up in an attic basement, and the cycle will continue.

By all means leave out a few things that have particular significance to you but, by and large, I've learned that less is generally more.

Re: I continue to no longer attend vintage computer festivals

#182

I was in Google Patent Litigation, and we actively collected old stuff, for possible use as prior art. I even went to Beryl Nelson's house before she died to collect her old Bell System Technical Journals. A lot of old stuff has no value to anyone. That can be hard to accept, but it's true. Even old wood furniture -- no one wants it. Old PC or Byte Magazines? Forget it; they're all over.

Not only this, but accepting a donation is not an obligation to preserve something for an endless period of time.

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Re: I continue to no longer attend vintage computer festivals

#183

Hi, Jason Scott here. Just stopping in to say I'm surprised how much of this thread is about wood furniture.

If a few people have learned that you've got to be careful keeping wood furniture around salt water, this thread will not have been in vain.

Re: I continue to no longer attend vintage computer festivals

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The maximum useful resolution you can really get out of offset-printed magazines is around 200dpi. Scanners have been able to do 400dpi for many years, and have been stuck at the 1200dpi plateau for about as long. Sometimes you just don't need a better scan, because you're just doubling up on data you already have.

There are lots of other issues that can occur with scans beyond just the raw resolution: misaligned pages (part of the text accidentally cut off from the scan), accidentally skipped pages, colour illustrations scanned in black and white, etc. With a sufficiently robust QA process, you may be able to catch most of these issues. However, you can never reduce the probability to zero, and people scanning old computer man…

There's also some types of papers and inks that don't scan well. Omni Magazine used metallic inks in some of their issues, as did many tech magazines of the period, probably because it looked futuristic. These don't scan well and even if the content of the page is preserved, the look isn't. At which point it becomes as question of how much of the value of storing artifacts of the past is in the presentation in addition to the content?

Re: I continue to no longer attend vintage computer festivals

#185
post #16

> I also want to take this moment to clearly state that Evan Koblentz, the director of the Vintage Computer Federation for many years, who took the original donation, had absolutely no say or part in this pulping of historical magazines, having been driven out of the organization years before. Sounds like new staff came in and they decided to clean things up, but decided to keep the plastic boxes.

I had no idea who this guy was but did a web search to fill myself in and all this turned up ... https://lists.vcfed.org/pipermail/vcf-midatlantic/2019-Decem... Allegedly he'd quit three times in one year: https://lists.vcfed.org/pipermail/vcf-midatlantic/2019-Decem... https://lists.vcfed.org/pipermail/vcf-midatlantic/2019-Decem... I dunno, the whole damn situation stinks, but it feels like there's a hell of a lot mo…

> the outcome of that was that Jason opted to berate and belittle me.

If when communicating with him you trivialized the loss of a couple dozen large containers of historical IEEE-related documents that he saved, packed up and rented a truck to deliver as "just a box of magazines," I bet he did berate you.

Re: I continue to no longer attend vintage computer festivals

#186

This is a real storm in a hissy teacup stuff. One guy's coveted old computer magazines is another guy's paper recycling. Maybe the author should have first checked to see if these were any use better elsewhere.

I know nothing about this stuff and have never had the desire to "collect" anything. But it seems like part of the problem is that the author received these materials from other folks who trusted him to find a good home for them on. So he feels a sense of responsibility to the folks who gave him the stuff.

The author has racked up significant debt hoarding other archival materials over the years so yeah he's a little disappointed someone else just threw stuff he spent good money on saving

Re: I continue to no longer attend vintage computer festivals

#187
post #121

I attended the SoCal Vintage Computer festival, went to a talk and when they asked for questions, seeing no one else asking questions, I asked if anyone wrote malware for these systems now that they’re internet connected. The inventor of the device (Thomas Cherryhomes) immediately belittled the question and asked why anyone would want to do that (the irony seemed to escape him, given that he built a network interface…

He's intensely invested in it, and sometimes comes off frustrated at the lack of interest (based on what I see on mastodon, happen to share instances). The suggestion of malware was probably somewhat offensive as it is antithical to bringing disparate retro system users together. Sorry that happened, but I think he is an unusual case. Hoping to provide some understanding for why it played out that way even though you…

I have various electronic/computer things that various people would silently scream if they knew I was tossing them. I'll probably make a nominal effort to find a home but just a nominal effort and I bet they'll end up in someone else's attic after they've played around for a day or so.

Re: I continue to no longer attend vintage computer festivals

#188
post #180
post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the silliest part about this “saga” is that Jason is leading a one-man boycott at his own detriment. He’s depriving himself of a social community meeting place for his passion because his donation to the organization that facilitates those meetups wasn’t put to some kind of completely unspecified use. > A number of years later, I contacted the Vintage Computer Federation to ask how the magazines were doing, i…

This has to be one of the lamest, or if you prefer "silliest", possible responses. > If he wants the materials to be part of a project, he should have spent the time needed to make them into a project. But really, Jason doesn’t know what to do with them, that’s why he donated them in the first place. > It’s not much different than dropping off an attic full of miscellaneous paintings to the Met and expecting them to…

For such a "silly" response from me, it's interesting that the author is doing exactly what I said he should do, as you pointed out. Doesn't sound all that silly to me if we all agree on that point.

But also, it's a bit surprising to me that a professional archivist didn't think of this possibility way before this incident occured, considering that pretty much every philanthropist organization on the planet handles gifting with stipulations and guardrails as a very well-known practice.

> If people feel you've treated them badly, even if it is totally allowed, they may exercise their freedom to tell others about it and refuse to associate with you further.

Related to this quote, I emphasize how my comment is in the context of the perspective of someone on the side of the organization. That person believes there wasn't malice involved and had some points that I thought were well-reasoned.

I am similarly free to criticize that person who is telling others about their bad experience. I'm free to say "that guy on Yelp who is boycotting Taco Bell forever because one franchise location gave him stale cinnamon twists is wack."

From the outside looking in it looks kind of ridiculous. Like, here's a guy with a picture of a bunch of unmarked plastic bins in his back yard next to a bunch of other discarded items like a Chevy Blazer, used tire, and some kind of rusty metal barrel, so forgive me for questioning whether these bins contain anything of value. And then there's another picture of the still-unmarked bins in a dingy looking warehouse full of also-unmarked over-stacked cardboard boxes, and the guy leaving his stuff there acts shocked that a place that looks like that didn't do a good job with preservation.

If you didn't know Jared was a well-known archivist you'd probably assume this was another case of my Grandma asking me to go through her record collection or take her fine china because they're "valuable."

Re: I continue to no longer attend vintage computer festivals

#190

Other than folks generally lamenting the situation there are quite a few who seem to have their knickers in a twist. There are a number of people who seem to need PR training, or basic human decency training in relation to this topic. The original post, and this one were very civl and dry (here's my story with plain delivery). The responses being so... charged is not not a good look. It makes the groups and people re…

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