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Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

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Re: Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

#181
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole thing feels very ... "original xbox" to me. Hear me out. It was argued that a big part of the original xbox for Microsoft was making sure they had a toehold in the gaming console market because that market had a change of disrupting the personal computer - and if that happened, they wanted to be there for it and have something ready to go. They did something similar with phones, and we can see how it specta…

No way will this tech destroy phones as you know them today. What is going to destroy phones is natural language. Maybe, maybe in the distant future this tech will be mature enough to provide the visual support to a natural language first device. xBox addressed a very well defined product sector with a couple of big players doing stuff that is well understood. xBox wasn't a toe in the water, they planned a whole stra…

> No way will this tech destroy phones as you know them today.

This device? No, absolutely not. I see it as a speculative play by Apple: release a very capable device with a bare-bones ecosystem at a high price.

"Early adopters" will buy it because that's what they do.

"Influencers" will buy it, because that's what they do. Their social media posts about it will give Apple all the data they need to nail down the size of the potential market.

Finally, developers will buy it, because it's cool tech. We'll tell ourselves that it's an emerging market, and we can get it early. The launch of the iOS App Store spawned a gold rush for app developers; I expect that the launch of the AVP and its visionOS App Store will do the same. The size and profitability of that opportunity will be determined by how well Apple develops and popularizes the product.

This is where I'm at on it. I expect the AVP to be best-in-class in terms of hardware and OS-level integration (though, to be fair, I expect the latter will be limited at first in odd ways, in the grand Apple tradition).

I'll get one. I plan to use it for productivity, and as long as that justifies the cost I'll be happy with it. I'll also work on some minimal apps for visionOS. The purpose there will be to "skill up". If Apple releases a more consumer-focus headset that gains adoption, I'll be in a good position to take advantage of that by selling paid apps that are already mature by the time the general public are getting on the bandwagon.

> What is going to destroy phones is natural language.

Maybe?

We've heard about "wearable computing" and "personal area networks" for decades at this point. While it still feels like something in the near future, the truth of the matter is that for a large segment of the population, it's already here. I already have an iPhone with me whenever I'm away from home, and usually an iPad as well. If I'm going to be away from home for a while, I've got an MBP in my backpack. All of those devices can hand off tasks between each other to an increasingly large degree - it's not uncommon for me to pull out my phone to show someone a website I had open on my laptop before I left home, then pull out my iPad if they're interested in it so they can interact with it more easily. Until recently, I had an Apple Watch surfacing an integrated notification stream from all of the above.

Today, smartphones are the central "wearable computing" device that ties everything together. They act as a hub for a computing experience. There's no guarantee in my mind that it will continue in that role forever. Maybe the hub will end up being the descendant of the AVP. Maybe it will be something more akin to a Humane AI Pin, or a Rabbit R1.

In other words... phones have already destroyed phones. Smartphones are really wearable computing hubs that we just happen to still _call_ "phones", because that's what they used to be. They're very rarely used for telephony, and many other devices are capable of doing so.

> Maybe, maybe in the distant future this tech will be mature enough to provide the visual support to a natural language first device.

My hope is that it ends up being a "spatial" interface that provides a generic interface so it can be used by pretty much anything.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

#182
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Would you recommend them? Yes, no, maybe. Thing is, I've never used a device or software that I haven't found faults with. Overall, the Quest has turned into a solid, though still imperfect, platform, with Meta pushing updates at a consistent, but also breakneck pace, sometimes at the expense of addressing existing issues. Hand tracking from the early days of the Q2 has made massive leaps and has become my preferre…

I use my xreal air as my airplane display. I would love the Quest 3's higher resolution but my understanding is that compared to the XA the Q3 - Requires controllers - Requires wifi instead of plugging in the cable and it just works* - Has fairly limited battery life Am I mistaken on these points / do you think it would work on an airplane despite them? * To be fair, the XA only "just works" in vanilla display mode,…

Tried my hand at a Viture One for two weeks, but the diopters did not work with my specific vision, perhaps I'll give the new XA2 a shot now that they are more available in the EU.

Concerning your question, it's very different. While VR content can be cast both over USB or wireless, for flat-screen casting, wireless is the preferred and most comprehensively supported way, which, whilst tether-free, can be less seamless when out-and-about than just plugging in a cable. Note that wireless does not require a local WiFi router or internet connection but can also be handeled directly from a host device, still, less reliable than a plain cable carrying video signal. Furthermore, as the Quest has its own full on operating system based on Android, rather than receiving an HDMI signal like the Viture or XA, there is an additional point of complexity to consider, and it looks a lot less inconspicuous than the XA. Lastly, tracking via the cameras is a great advantage in general use, though a very inclosed, darkish space such as an aeroplane may push the small sensors to their limit and yes, battery life can be a limit as well, though I do hot-swap BoboVR battery at the back of my skull for that. Still not as convenient as just using your phones power and having that charged.

Quest does not require an controller at this point, hand tracking is currently my prefered way of navigating the system day-to-day.

Overall, I'd agree, on an airplane I'd consider the Quest to be of marginal usability.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

#183
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good analysis. Part of it too is that Apple feels pressure to do something innovative. They made some big bets in the 2000s that paid off very well but a company that has a hit like the iPhone becomes profoundly conservative. The trouble is that there aren't many market opportunities bigger than smartphones, there's a possible iCar and an iHouse and that's about it. Apple's worst fear might be being successful as a n…

I wonder if an iTV would sell. All mondern smart tvs are covered in ads and spying. monitors of similar sizes cost 3x to 4x. so to me there might be a market for a non spying iTV with bultin Apple TV for say 1.5x. Or not, not sure enough people care about those issues.

Apple TV already exists as a set-top box.

And even something similar embedded in some TVs.

What I could see Apple doing is some kind of "Made for Apple TV" feature that combines eArc, HDMI, etc, and makes the TV turn into a "dumb TV" for the Apple TV when it is connected and detected.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

#184
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if an iTV would sell. All mondern smart tvs are covered in ads and spying. monitors of similar sizes cost 3x to 4x. so to me there might be a market for a non spying iTV with bultin Apple TV for say 1.5x. Or not, not sure enough people care about those issues.

> I wonder if an iTV would sell. All mondern smart tvs are covered in ads and spying. Probably best to just connect TVs to some box (Apple TV, Roku, etc ) via plain HDMI and leave it that. There's no technical reason to connect TVs to an IP directly anymore IMHO: what would that actually provide over and above what you get with some box/stick?

Ethernet over HDMI exists, luckily it hasn't taken off ...

Re: Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

#185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good analysis. Part of it too is that Apple feels pressure to do something innovative. They made some big bets in the 2000s that paid off very well but a company that has a hit like the iPhone becomes profoundly conservative. The trouble is that there aren't many market opportunities bigger than smartphones, there's a possible iCar and an iHouse and that's about it. Apple's worst fear might be being successful as a n…

> Apple might be left with the maintenance burden forever but no real prospects for a mainstream product. This seems unlikely. Apple has not hesitated in the past to exit market segments they felt did not suit them. To name a few: servers, displays, routers.

And to be fair to Apple, on those sunsetted products, they supported them quite well during the sunset and even after, especially the Xserve.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

#186

I guess Apple had to do Vision Pro to make investors shut up, but I have a feeling it will be the next Pippin or Lisa. Apple does exceedingly well when there already is a growing mass market and they can offer something "better". Home computers (Apple II), PCs (Macintosh), smartphones (iPhone), tablets (iPad). They don't always succeed, e.g. servers, gaming consoles. There isn't a growing mass market for heavy and ex…

> tablets (iPad) There effectively wasn’t a tablet market before the iPad. You also forgot ‘mp3 player’ - which was a market not created by Apple but there wasn’t really a “growing mass market” - it was niche at best.

There was a massive portable analog audio player market before MP3 players came along. So Apple could improve on the attempts to offer a digital audio alternative. And they did. This supports what I wrote about the purpose of Apple Vision Pro. There is none. VR has forever been a solution looking for a problem.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

#187
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think AirPods were post-Steve? And they were both widely mocked at launch and wildly successful.

Like so many Apple things, I thought AirPods were dumb until I got some (as a gift). I'd tried some Logitech wireless earbuds just a couple months before first trying AirPods. Those were dumb. God they sucked. I've avoided the Watch for that reason. The little conveniences of various Apple-thingies are the sort of stuff you can't un-experience, and then you're stuck buying the damn things forever.

If it makes you feel any better, I think the watch is more of a "pickup or put down" device, especially if you do not usually use a watch. I sometimes wear it religiously, meaning all the time, and sometimes religiously, meaning only for an hour on Sundays and holy days ;).

Re: Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

#188
post #23

Ha, I was downvoted and told "why do we need controllers, the iphone and macbook dont come with controllers" yesterday when I said this is stupid without controllers. I have a vive, q2 and q3. Look at him trying to type on that keyboard. I have hand gestures on my q3. They're nice for a few certain things, but thankfully I can forget they exist for 99% of what I do, that isn't flinging windows/screens left and right…

> And.. you can't do multiple screens and it has less resolution than my real life monitor when connecting to a mbp

I think there's still appeal in that you can take this monitor with you and float it in front of you wherever you want. That's worth the reduced resolution imo

Re: Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

#189
post #23

Ha, I was downvoted and told "why do we need controllers, the iphone and macbook dont come with controllers" yesterday when I said this is stupid without controllers. I have a vive, q2 and q3. Look at him trying to type on that keyboard. I have hand gestures on my q3. They're nice for a few certain things, but thankfully I can forget they exist for 99% of what I do, that isn't flinging windows/screens left and right…

> And.. you can't do multiple screens and it has less resolution than my real life monitor when connecting to a mbp.. hm. I thought that was a super cool feature when I thought you could just add monitors wherever. I hadn't even thought of it before they showed it in the demo.

That's the main feature I would have bought this device for - seamless window sharing between apple devices/macbooks. Sad to see it isn't the case. Hopefully the immersed visor [0] pans out for work! Excited to try vision pro, but seeming likely that I'll end up returning it by the 2 week period.

[0] - https://www.visor.com/.

Disclaimer, I have a preorder for both Visor and Vision Pro.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review: magic, until it's not

#190
post #153

This review confirmed this is exactly what I need. I don’t care about my hair messing up, I work from home. I don’t care if the display doesn’t look as good as reality, that was never my expectation anyway. The display just needs to look good enough to work with fine text and hi-res images. I don’t care if it’s too heavy to wear for hours at a time, I always work in 25 minute blocks anyway. Breaks are good. I don’t c…

Same for me but there was a single sentence that more than halved my interest in buying this: you can’t have multiple floating windows of MacOS. It’s all in one single floating window. This is by far the biggest flaw for me, and a really stupid one. Hopefully a software update changes this

The 1 monitor cap and the fact that it's only a 1440p resolution makes me think it's a bandwidth/latency limitation, I wouldn't hold my breath on software fixing it.
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