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Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

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Re: Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

#181

Post by jacquesm »

PrimeMcFly wrote: post #180
jacquesm wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU does not mandate popups. The EU mandates consent to be tracked. You could simply not track and then you wouldn't need consent. Or you could do it without a popup.

> The EU does not mandate popups. The EU mandates consent to be tracked. Same difference. Semantics. > You could simply not track and then you wouldn't need consent. Not all tracking is malicious. It's not going to disappear, hence the popups. As I said, it's an asinine solution. It's as useless as the default browser nonsense. The EU seems to make one of these annoying blunders every decade or so, next one should be…

You have cause and effect mixed up, that's fine by me but you're not helping yourself - or the rest of the world - by doing that. The EU is simply trying to ensure that the rights of its subjects are respected. Companies apparently care more about their bottom line than either the comfort or the rights of those subjects and that is why you have those popups. Note that on my website there are no such popups and yet I'm completely in compliance with the law. Every other website could do the same.

Re: Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

#182

Post by PrimeMcFly »

jacquesm wrote: post #181
PrimeMcFly wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The EU does not mandate popups. The EU mandates consent to be tracked. Same difference. Semantics. > You could simply not track and then you wouldn't need consent. Not all tracking is malicious. It's not going to disappear, hence the popups. As I said, it's an asinine solution. It's as useless as the default browser nonsense. The EU seems to make one of these annoying blunders every decade or so, next one should be…

You have cause and effect mixed up, that's fine by me but you're not helping yourself - or the rest of the world - by doing that. The EU is simply trying to ensure that the rights of its subjects are respected. Companies apparently care more about their bottom line than either the comfort or the rights of those subjects and that is why you have those popups. Note that on my website there are no such popups and yet I'…

> You have cause and effect mixed up, that's fine by me but you're not helping yourself - or the rest of the world - by doing that.

That's simply not true.

The EU legislated solution is directly responsible for the popup spam. There were other alternate solutions that would not lead to popup spam.

Your site may not need a popup, but many more complex sites do, and not because they are doing nefarious things.

It's OK to admit the EU makes bonehead decisions sometimes.

Re: Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

#183

Post by jamedjo »

turquoisevar wrote: post #162
slotrans wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cookie banners are absolutely the fault of the EU. Users have always been in control of whether they accept cookies. There have been settings in your browser since (at least) Netscape 3.0. It's only because of dumb EU laws that cookie control has been pushed up into "user space" with these idiotic banners that no one reads.

Really? Did Netscape 3.0 have per-site options to enable cookies and specifically allow/block third party cookies? If so, that’s impressive.

Our machines always had Cookie Pal [0] installed on them, and it allowed per domain settings for rejecting cookies and control over third party cookies [1].

> Cookie Pal includes the following features:

> Automatically and transparently accepts or rejects cookies from all or specified servers without user interaction.

> Cookies received from unspecified servers can be automatically accepted or rejected without user interaction, or the user can be asked for confirmation.

> "On the fly" adding of servers to the accept from and reject from lists, allows you to manually accept or reject a cookie the first time it is received and then have it automatically accepted or rejected every time it is received thereafter.

[0] https://web.archive.org/web/19971012223847/http://www.kburra...

[1] https://web.archive.org/web/20010331050614/http://www.kburra...

Re: Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

#184

Post by throw10920 »

Kovah wrote: post #21

Instead of hating the EU, how about directing your hate towards the bad players of the web? Cookie banners are not the fault of the EU, but the fault of companies disrespecting privacy rights and pushing data collection, ads and all possible shady growth hacking strategies towards the user. I am glad that a government body actually made this possible and made visible how horrible the internet is.

Enforcement is part of regulation. If the policymakers of the EU put regulation in place without enforcing it promptly and consistently, then it is indeed fair to blame them for this mess.

Re: Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

#185

Post by crnkofe »

I no longer stay on websites that require consent, show overlays, demand subscriptions and signups or do any other funky anti-user maneuvers. Just let this part of the web die.

Web is already hostile enough nowadays with all the tracking, scams, abuses of consent and bad ux designed to sell shit nobody needs.

Re: Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

#186

Post by freetinker »

probably_wrong wrote: post #41

Disclaimer: I actually click through the "do not consent" procedure, which tells a lot about what I'm about to say. When the EU regulation came up, I was shocked that a single article was being shared with 100+ "partners". I knew it was bad, but I didn't know it was that bad. At least now I get the choice to opt-out. Sidenote: Google got fined for that pop-up because it should have a "do not accept" option [1]. Compa…

Precisely - malicious compliance.

Re: Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

#187

Post by snehk »

qeternity wrote: post #99
Kovah wrote: post #21

Instead of hating the EU, how about directing your hate towards the bad players of the web? Cookie banners are not the fault of the EU, but the fault of companies disrespecting privacy rights and pushing data collection, ads and all possible shady growth hacking strategies towards the user. I am glad that a government body actually made this possible and made visible how horrible the internet is.

> disrespecting privacy rights It's not as if these companies are kicking in your door and violating your right to privacy. You're accessing their site with a device that is configured to transmit whatever you have it set to. If you don't want cookies, disable cookies. If you want greater control, go and configure it yourself. Stop forcing your preferences on everyone. The reality is that outside of a vocal contingen…

Tracking doesn't only happen through cookies. I thought this was well-known?

Re: Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

#188

Post by rvieira »

probably_wrong wrote: post #41

Disclaimer: I actually click through the "do not consent" procedure, which tells a lot about what I'm about to say. When the EU regulation came up, I was shocked that a single article was being shared with 100+ "partners". I knew it was bad, but I didn't know it was that bad. At least now I get the choice to opt-out. Sidenote: Google got fined for that pop-up because it should have a "do not accept" option [1]. Compa…

Yep, exactly. Unfortunately, it is working.

People will choose convenience over mostly everything else.

Re: Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

#189

Post by ktosobcy »

danhau wrote: post #36
ktosobcy wrote: post #18

But you know that the problem are we operators - right? There could be browser configuration for the cookie consent popup (accept, essential, reject all) that websites could follow but now - they prefer to be obnoxious about it hoping that everyone will click "allow" pit of boredom (not to mention that at the beginning it was only visible option and reject was hidden, which was illegal)...

This. It boggles the mind that browser vendors (and standards committee) haven‘t come up with a preferences page for cookie consent. Expose that through JS and/or send it to the server via a HTTP header.

It's not the browser vendors (well, save for morons from google) because there is DoNotTrack header but it's not used/enforced. EU could amend the law to include that and it would be AWESOME.

Re: Sigh, this is what browsing the web in the EU looks like nowadays (2021)

#190

Post by dns_snek »

slotrans wrote: post #155
Kovah wrote: post #21

Instead of hating the EU, how about directing your hate towards the bad players of the web? Cookie banners are not the fault of the EU, but the fault of companies disrespecting privacy rights and pushing data collection, ads and all possible shady growth hacking strategies towards the user. I am glad that a government body actually made this possible and made visible how horrible the internet is.

Cookie banners are absolutely the fault of the EU. Users have always been in control of whether they accept cookies. There have been settings in your browser since (at least) Netscape 3.0. It's only because of dumb EU laws that cookie control has been pushed up into "user space" with these idiotic banners that no one reads.

It seems like you don't practice what you preach, seeing how Hacker News relies on cookies for authentication.

Besides, GDPR isn't about cookies, it's about what companies are allowed to do with your personal information. Functional cookies don't require consent, abuse of your personal data does.

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