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GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

libreboot.org

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Re: GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

#181

Post by INTPenis »

zeroCalories wrote: post #4

Haha, I can't deny that I love the catty drama that happens around the free software community. While I do wish people would get along better for the health of the project, I also suspect that these strong characters are why the movement hasn't been completedo taken over by corporate interests.

The way I see it is there's office drama just like this, difference is that open source is transparent for everyone to see, and global. It's like a global office that we all get glimpses into.

And in this particular case, it reminds me of Red Hat and CentOS actually. Because one project just wants to ensure that people who download are actually getting and not something else. That concern is just as valid in open source as it is in big enterprise.

Re: GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

#182

Post by b112 »

mcv wrote: post #168
whstl wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that the person who sent the C&D email allegedly tried to "take over" the Libreboot name (according to TFA) is also not a good look. I found this: https://libreboot.at > Who are we? Denis ‘GNUtoo’ Carikli and Adrien ‘neox’ Bourmault. We created this and maintain it. > take a stand for fully free software is to change URLs across the web from to , and to let people know that no other version of Libreboot is r…

I hadn't heard about this drama before, but as I can piece things together, Leah has been maintaining Libreboot and another boot system for years. Denis and Adrien disagreed with Leah's decision to include binaries, created their own version of Libreboot without those binaries and published it under the same name on a very similar domain trying to claim the existing Libreboot name for their version. Then I suspect Le…

I often wonder if someone is whispering in people's ears, to destroy such projects.

For example, a long email history on any of these people(and even if you don't use, people you email do use gmail), from a central store such as gmail, would provide immense insight into personality traits, etc.

Which means external motivaters could be used as handy leavers to drive dissent.

Little spats like this, erode project trust, and just divert energy.

Anyhow, no idea if this is happening. I guess if you really do want to destroy something, just let Oracle buy it, so maybe I'm off here.

Re: GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

#183

Post by pravus »

Propelloni wrote: post #173
whstl wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no idea who those people are and their pasts, and have no horse in this race, but according to the https://libreboot.at website by Adrien Bourmault, Leah was the founder of the project. According to this [1], the alleged takeover you mention not only didn't involve Adrien or Denis Carikli, it also happened in 2021, two years before the creation of https://libreboot.at , which seems to be from 2023, and GNU Boo…

It appears to be a bonfire of vanities on all sides. One side goes "I use the trust you invested in me to block you from project resources, because my other project is soo much better but has less name-recognition." The other side goes "We are more pure, more righteous, and more petty at the same time! Let's show the other side by registering a confusing domain name and release a similiar but still different software…

Welcome to the GNU universe. This kind of thing was more prominent in the 00's and I've basically sworn off ever contributing to any GPL projects or using GPL licenses because of how GNU has acted over time. At odd times they get extremely vocal over issues and the responses are typically of the "you are wrong" kind.

Re: GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

#184

Post by martin8412 »

zdimension wrote: post #141
slim wrote: post #116

[flagged]

Most importantly, she disagreed with the FSF's policy of never using any binary blob anywhere for any reason, because that was incompatible with the goal of supporting as much hardware as possible. Hence, the GNU Boot fork. But then, those guys trying to reappropriate the Libreboot name...

Well, the FSF policy is completely stupid. They allow binary blobs if loaded from an EEPROM that can't be updated by the user. If the user can update them, they're not allowed.

Re: GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

#185

Post by jokethrowaway »

wkat4242 wrote: post #38
PrimeMcFly wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He said cohesive, not 'kohesive'.

KDE is by far the better desktop, Gnome will never be great as long as they abhor choice. The "you're using it wrong" is too strong there.

I agree on KDE being better but that's just because they consistently put in the effort and results piled up over time.

Sure, with a few setbacks (cue 4.0 nightmares) but overall their technological choices (Qt in primis), architecture and quality of contributors won the battle.

Gnome used to be way more polished at the Gnome 2 vs KDE 3 era but kind of lost its way over time.

It's definitely not about unchangeable defaults vs configuration (there's a market for both).

Re: GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

#186

Post by jokethrowaway »

FireInsight wrote: post #122
housemusicfan wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just Google "libreboot drama" and make sure to clear your schedule for the evening.

Wow, it's been a while since I heard so much use of "SJW". I think Leah's actions here seemed defensible. You can easily understand how a trans person would feel uncomfortable being part of or under a project that they find as hostile to their own identity.

[flagged]

Re: GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

#187

Post by nmrrl »

LukeShu wrote: post #92
k_roy wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The pro-RMS vs anti-RMS thing going on since RMS's removal from the FSF in 2019 it's been going on MUCH longer than that. No matter what he's done for free software, he's also a super-creep based on some of his comments

I mean, yes, but it was brought to a crest then. It went from a bunch of folks in the community separately saying "yeah, he's kinda problematic..." to a bunch of folks standing together and saying "he's problematic!" So of course it had been going on a while if more than 3000 people were "suddenly" willing to sign the open letter against him.

3000 people "stand up". The other 1000,000 are flagged. Nice brigading going on here.

Re: GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

#188

Post by pmontra »

raverbashing wrote: post #169
pmontra wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not my experience. I have a Gnome desktop that maybe a Gnome developer have a hard time to recognize as such. It works as I want and I keep the convenience of being able to Google problems and solutions of a mainstream desktop (KDE being the other one) and not a more or less obscure one. This means that under the hood, using extensions, you can customize that Gnome car. Can an Apple automatic car do that as easily?

It's good that you can do this, but most people prefer the default experience instead of fiddling with customizations to make it more special. And yes, fiddling and customizing is cool, when you have time. So between the Apple automatic and Gnome "pick customizations" I know which one I prefer (and yes Apple does have extensions, settings, etc). Yes, there won't be a perfect solution and sometimes you kinda miss some…

I do use Sound Input & Output Device Chooser. Great improvement over the default.

If I'll ever buy a Mac (and I can't imagine why) I'd want to totally change its windows management and make it as close as possible to Gnome 2 and Windows XP, with virtual desktops (Gnome 2 had them.) I would probably disable all gestures except scrolling and zooming.

I'd also shed tears about the lack of physical buttons on the touchpad but that starts to be about the hardware, which is off-topic.

Re: GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

#189

Post by cassianoleal »

Incipient wrote: post #110
wolverine876 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an essential point. At the same time the interpretation isn't completely random or unpredictable; we're all humans, with the same emotions, the same physiological expressions of them, and the same internal responses to others' emotions. If you yell at someone anywhere, you can expect a certain range of emotional responses.

Anecdotal counterpoint about "yelling". I was having a conversation with my mother at a Cafe. After 15mins the lady next to us, very genuinely and nicely, asked if we were ok because we were yelling at each other. We're Italian. That was our normal conversation! Someone's definition of aggressive discourse is definitely not everyone's.

My mom’s side of the family is descendent from Italians. Sunday barbecues were always full of yelling, shouting and cursing at each other.

I miss those times. By the end of the day, everybody would hug and kiss and say goodbye until next Sunday.

Re: GNU Boot sent a cease and desist to Libreboot

#190

Post by 0dayz »

slabity wrote: post #24

> I did this release for them Did I miss something? Over the past 7 years the Libreboot project has been extremely aggressive towards the FSF. Going so far as to say the GNU project shouldn't exist and throwing insults at individuals in the organization. The emphasis on the whole, "I did this release for them" honestly doesn't pass the sniff test and kind of feels like they're intentionally trying to create drama. Th…

I was completely unaware of this, and yet they collaborate with each other? Do you have potential sources for this?
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