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WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

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Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#181

Post by carlmr »

whiskers wrote: post #151
stevenwoo wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I started making baking at home when pandemic lockdowns started and with only flour, yeast, salt, oil and sugar my bread grows mold within one to two days (2 cups of flour with 1 teaspoon of sugar) I speculate my home humidity might be high without air conditioning or heat but it seems a lot of something is necessary to prevent commercial bread products from molding for a long time.

Home baked bread freezes really well so take advantage of that! I also bake a lot of bread at home and usually make a batch of 1kg of flour at a time, that results in two good sized loaves - one goes in the freezer until the other is finished. I freeze it in an air tight bag, and I take it out of the freezer a day before we want to start using it and let it thaw at room temperature.

+1 for freezing. Additionally if you want less planning around when to thaw, I slice my bread before freezing, and then put it in the toaster to reheat it, with a bit of added crisp.

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#182

Post by carlmr »

stevenwoo wrote: post #137
uranium wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American bread certainly does go moldy, but the sugar absorbs moisture and keeps the bread softer longer. That being said, I'd much rather they used less. At this point it's pretty hard to buy a hamburger bun around here [SF] that doesn't taste like a brioche to me.

I started making baking at home when pandemic lockdowns started and with only flour, yeast, salt, oil and sugar my bread grows mold within one to two days (2 cups of flour with 1 teaspoon of sugar) I speculate my home humidity might be high without air conditioning or heat but it seems a lot of something is necessary to prevent commercial bread products from molding for a long time.

How do you store it? Do you have a bread box?

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#183

Post by opan »

mike10921 wrote: post #46
DrThunder wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh I get what you're saying but I don't think most people who switch to vaping actually stop quit nicotine all together, they just continue vaping with often higher levels of nicotine. I guess they have the advantage of getting rid of second-hand smoke and the permeating smell of cigarettes. I think a similar thing happens with "diet" "sugar-free" products. Almost all of the people who use these products neglect ever…

Nicotine itself is not more harmful than coffee or similar products. It is the smoking that is the main health risk. Assuming that vaping is less harmful, that would make it a win if one was to choose between smoking and vaping. Of course, doing neither is the absolute best choice.

Gwern has some good writing on Nicotine if anyone's curious. He basically used it in small doses as a nootropic.

https://gwern.net/nicotine

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#184

Post by carlmr »

twic wrote: post #133
bbatha wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ask someone from 100 years ago to sweeten a glass of lemonade "to taste" and you'd get something so weak that a consumer of diet soda would mock it like the meme "hint of hint of lime" or "transported on a truck near strawberries" flavors of LaCroix. This is quiet a suspicious claim if you've studied food or beverage history. We have cocktail recipes dating back 150 years, and punch recipes dating back almost 500.…

Reminds me of how sweet champagne used to be [1]: > The most common style today is Brut [(6 to 12 grams of sugar per litre)]. However, throughout the 19th century and into the early 20th century Champagne was generally much sweeter than it is today. Moreover, except in Britain, Champagne was drunk as dessert wines (after the meal), rather than as table wines (with the meal).[55] At this time, Champagne sweetness was…

I think this might have to do with sugar being more expensive.

Today sugary drinks are associated with poverty, lack of self-control, lack of education. Champagne is a status signaling drink, you don't want to signal that.

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#185

Post by YeGoblynQueenne »

omnicognate wrote: post #179
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me what is saddening is that those were your childhood tastes. That stuff should never have been allowed to be sold to kids. Coloured sugar water should not be what someone remembers as a childhood treat. Then again, I understand. I'm a long-term exile to the UK from a Mediterranean country. Fruit and veg in the UK are absolutely tasteless and therefore pointless as anything but a sort of medicine. You guys are re…

What a bizarre little drive-by. You make several assumptions about my life, tastes and eating habits that couldn't be further from the truth, but I don't have to defend myself. I'm sorry to hear you've moved to the UK but aren't earning enough to afford decent fruit and veg.

Wait, what assumption did I make? You said that Ribena, Irn Bru and friends are "childhood tastes". I made no other assumption. The rest of my comment is my experience of living in the UK.

And there's nobody more sorry of this than me but the food in the UK is shite. There's this story I like to tell where I was buying bread from the Waitrose and it tasted like carton, like it had a distinct taste of wet box. So I figured they just don't know how to make bread because they're British and bread is not their thing. So I bought some flour and made my own bread... and it tasted exactly the same. Because it was the flour that tasted like carton. That was wholemeal flour, Waitrose own brand, and Waitrose is supposed to be "posh" or "poncy" or whatever. "Supposed" as in the British call it that because it has decent produce, imagine that.

And if it was just the bread! Everything I've ever eaten Made in Britain tastes bland, odorless, tasteless, like the perfect murder poison.

Then I take the ferry and cross to France and finally bread tastes of bread, again, cheese tastes of cheese, coffee tastes of coffee and not of boiled rotten socks. The fruit and veg is still not stellar, mind, but at least I can finally enjoy food. And if I take the train and go back home, every stop on the way I can taste the coffee getting better the farther away I move from those wretched, miserable rain-drenched isles.

But, you know, the turnips are fine.

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#186

Post by stevenwoo »

carlmr wrote: post #182
stevenwoo wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I started making baking at home when pandemic lockdowns started and with only flour, yeast, salt, oil and sugar my bread grows mold within one to two days (2 cups of flour with 1 teaspoon of sugar) I speculate my home humidity might be high without air conditioning or heat but it seems a lot of something is necessary to prevent commercial bread products from molding for a long time.

How do you store it? Do you have a bread box?

I tried using bags and a bread box and neither worked for me so now I eat what I can when it's hot and after it's cooled down I freeze it in plastic food bags that are recycled from food stuffs I have bought. Reheating it in the oven at a lower temperature works great for me.

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#187

Post by dagw »

jrmg wrote: post #109
busyant wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> to create a "new normal" or new baseline where an e.g. strawberry is sweat again. Just an interesting story. About 5 years ago, I tried to cut out all processed carbs from my diet. After several months, I was away from home and I had to eat something ---the only thing open was a Dunkin Donuts. I ordered an egg-white sandwich on a plain English muffin, and for kicks I took a bite out of the English muffin. Holy shit…

I’m sure it did have added sugar. Basically all American supermarket bread products (including most bread!) do, and are are super sweet to Europeans. It extends shelf life though. European supermarket bread will mould in usually less than a week, but it’s really unusual for an American bread to go mouldy.

(including most bread!) do, and are are super sweet to Europeans.

Europeans, except Swedes. Swedish bread is also generally super sweet for some reason.

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#188

Post by irthomasthomas »

Someone1234 wrote: post #10

This was posted when it was published in May. To use an analogy their argument is: Vaping is bad for you, don't do it. While ignoring that a ton of people quit smoking using vapes and that they're letting the perfect be the enemy of good. Same thing with NSS. While NSS are a useful tool for sugar reduction, studies have shown that over the medium-long term, you'll want to reduce artificially sweat foods and even swea…

I'm afraid you might be wrong about that. Why do they keep inventing new sweeteners, now, every few years? After all, they're all sweet, and zero calories. But they keep investing money inventing new ones, when the customers are happy with the old ones.

Perhaps because the public research eventually catches up to them.

E.g. "sucralose ingestion caused 1) a greater incremental increase in peak plasma glucose concentrations (4.2 ± 0.2 vs. 4.8 ± 0.3 mmol/L; P = 0.03), 2) a 20 ± 8% greater incremental increase in insulin area under the curve (AUC) (P https://diabetesjournals.org/care/article/36/9/2530/37872/Su...

NNTs, sweet on the tongue, sweet on the liver! Yep, they trigger the same deleterious hormonal response that sugar does. They produce a cascading chemical chain reaction in the body leading to the over-production of insulin, the hunger-hormone, which signals your fat cells to begin absorbing glucose (triglycerides) from the blood stream. Removing the sugar from the bloodstream would normally cause insulin production to drop, but in this case, it's not the sugar triggering the productions, it's the NNT chemicals that are still circulating in your body..

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#189

Post by marliechiller »

YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #185
omnicognate wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a bizarre little drive-by. You make several assumptions about my life, tastes and eating habits that couldn't be further from the truth, but I don't have to defend myself. I'm sorry to hear you've moved to the UK but aren't earning enough to afford decent fruit and veg.

Wait, what assumption did I make? You said that Ribena, Irn Bru and friends are "childhood tastes". I made no other assumption. The rest of my comment is my experience of living in the UK. And there's nobody more sorry of this than me but the food in the UK is shite. There's this story I like to tell where I was buying bread from the Waitrose and it tasted like carton, like it had a distinct taste of wet box. So I fi…

> the farther away I move from those wretched, miserable rain-drenched isles.

you dont make a compelling case when you end your point with such bias

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#190

Post by wrp »

irthomasthomas wrote: post #188
Someone1234 wrote: post #10

This was posted when it was published in May. To use an analogy their argument is: Vaping is bad for you, don't do it. While ignoring that a ton of people quit smoking using vapes and that they're letting the perfect be the enemy of good. Same thing with NSS. While NSS are a useful tool for sugar reduction, studies have shown that over the medium-long term, you'll want to reduce artificially sweat foods and even swea…

I'm afraid you might be wrong about that. Why do they keep inventing new sweeteners, now, every few years? After all, they're all sweet, and zero calories. But they keep investing money inventing new ones, when the customers are happy with the old ones. Perhaps because the public research eventually catches up to them. E.g. "sucralose ingestion caused 1) a greater incremental increase in peak plasma glucose concentra…

> Why do they keep inventing new sweeteners...

Because nothing so far tastes as good as real sugar. The common practice in employing artificial sweeteners is to combine two or more in an effort to avoid the bitter aftertaste that you get from relying on just one.

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