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The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

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Re: The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

#181

Post by DonsDiscountGas »

pjc50 wrote: post #12

The other day someone was complaining about too many people in the housing thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35962521 The two are linked. Having children is at least partly an economic choice. People have spent decades working against "teen moms" and "single parents" and "welfare queens". Everyone is very clear that you must not have children unless you can comfortably afford to do so. And not just now, th…

It's not necessary to pay for other peoples housing, all that is necessary is to repeal absurd zoning laws and ridiculous bureaucracy that makes building such things 100x more expensive (if it's even possible) than they need to be.

Re: The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

#182

Post by balfirevic »

Aeolos wrote: post #167
balfirevic wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you just sleep, work, commute and do chores? That sounds dreadful to me.

I also have hobbies and a social life - but it has consequences. Family and children are entirely 100% impossible in this lifestyle without a stay-at-home partner. And unlike previous generations, stay-at-home partners are no longer a thing. (Edit: to make it clear, I am not making a judgement, nor wishing for a stay-at-home partner - I'm entirely in favour of everyone making their own choices in life. I am just poin…

Props to you man, I have no kids and still barely manage to have hobbies and social life with just normal full-time hours. I do need a lot of time to sleep and simply rest and do nothing, so that is a factor.

Re: The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

#183

Post by balfirevic »

throwaw12 wrote: post #176
balfirevic wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But I regularly see people committing code at 9pm or commenting on docs at 11pm or see their testing traces (logs) at 1am and on weekends That might not mean much - you'd see the same from me, but I don't work more than 8 hours/day (on average), I just work very irregular hours.

> I just work very irregular hours. Do you also come to office and spend 8 hours, even if you do nothing? I see those people in the office almost regularly

Yeah, makes sense if you see them in the office all the time.

I often come to the office for just a couple of hours and then do more work afterwards from home, and other days work entirely from home.

Re: The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

#184

Post by throwaw12 »

kbrkbr wrote: post #178
throwaw12 wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there are couple of differences between EU and US which can introduce confusion: 1. EU countries sees a lot immigration from Middle East and Africa, who has more kids and there is still a cultural difference towards having kids, give some time to those people to notice the environment and you see similar trend 2. but also EU countries have stronger labor policies which impacts birth rate. Not easy to fire, even when…

This may well be true. But it also may well be not true to the extend that it can explain that decline in US and the differences to similar countries. So far I’ve not seen much data to back up the alleged causality in much of this entire discussion.

sometimes discussions are just to share the opinion and disagreement, not always they contain result of research. I shared my disagreement about specific statement which says: "This decline cannot be explained by demographic, economic, or policy changes" and shared couple of economic and policy issues which might impact the birth rate.

Real reason(s) could be even different, e.g. chemicals used in foods or a plastic? we need a research. But expecting single reason is probably wrong

Re: The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

#185

Post by anjc »

withinboredom wrote: post #179
anjc wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you going to raise this with the school? It seems highly inappropriate on their part

Why would I bring my son’s opinions up with the school? Because they learned about global warming? Nah, we had a sit down talk about it and how it isn’t “any one specific person’s” fault.

Maybe I misunderstood but it seemed that he learned it was your fault, rather than this being an opinion he formed.

Re: The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

#186

Post by fileeditview »

CalRobert wrote: post #175
red_admiral wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

* (sociologic) fear of climate change (will the world still be habitable in 20 years' time) or commitment to make a small positive impact on climate change by not having kids I'm not saying this is true or rational (there are actually blog posts in the rationalist community along the lines of "no, having kids does not cause climate change") but it's definitely a sentiment I've encountered.

It's not about whether your kids will cause climate change. It's about creating children just in time for them to suffer through the collapse of civilisation.

The collapse of civilization is happening since the dawn of civilization.

Jokes aside, I have heard both points made. Yours and the one from the parent poster.

Re: The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

#187

Post by lynx23 »

pjc50 wrote: post #164
lynx23 wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe that seeking external recognition is only necessary when one is unsure and requires external validation to feel confident.

No, there are all sorts of very specific and sometimes tragic cases like "who is allowed at the bedside of their dying spouse in the hospital" where official recognition matters. The AIDS crisis produced a number of those incidents, but it's also happened to straight people as well that if you're not officially married you may find your partner's family having legal rights which you don't.

Well, as I am not married, this would also apply to my spouse and I. However, I dont feel like this is reason enough to marry, in fact, I never even thought about such a specific case. Death is painful, and likely will not go down as planned, so no reason to worry. See, not a gay marriage specific problem, just the way it is for unmarried couples.

Re: The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

#188

Post by willis936 »

carlmr wrote: post #78
throwaw12 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

* (sociologic) no trust in your partner (which is partly related to social networks and porn in some ways). they can divorce anytime, because it is easier to divorce than trying to resolve issues in the relationship, which will leave you as a single care taker of the kid, which creates 2 issues: (1) do you want to raise alone, making kid feel half family (2) can you actually raise alone with current demand at workpla…

Number one is very true. My generation has so many children of divorced parents that I don't see these trust issues ever being fixed. I'm not sure if it's attributable to porn though. I think it's rather our individualistic, bordering on narcissistic, culture that is driving this. As the old saying goes, it takes a village to raise a child. The next best thing after the village is the family. But in a society where t…

Divorce rates are going down and have been for generations.

Re: The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

#189

Post by recursivedoubts »

mihaic wrote: post #72
red_admiral wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

* (sociologic) fear of climate change (will the world still be habitable in 20 years' time) or commitment to make a small positive impact on climate change by not having kids I'm not saying this is true or rational (there are actually blog posts in the rationalist community along the lines of "no, having kids does not cause climate change") but it's definitely a sentiment I've encountered.

That feels actually anti-rational, since if the people that care about the environment stop having children that means the people that are passing on their life outlook are mostly ignorant of the environment. It must be a US thing more though, as I haven't personally heard people say fear of environmental damage to keep them from having kids.

it's irrational at the aggregate level, but rational at the individual level

many such cases

(the reverse happens a lot too)

Re: The U.S. birth rate has fallen by 20% since 2007

#190

Post by withinboredom »

anjc wrote: post #185
withinboredom wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would I bring my son’s opinions up with the school? Because they learned about global warming? Nah, we had a sit down talk about it and how it isn’t “any one specific person’s” fault.

Maybe I misunderstood but it seemed that he learned it was your fault, rather than this being an opinion he formed.

I mean it slightly is. I leave lights on, take long showers, drive a car, and lots of other things.
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