Nitpick alert:
> In the EU, regulators like the Norwegian Consumer Council have been focusing on dark patterns and their harms since 2018 [...]
Norway is not in the EU.
How companies use dark patterns to keep you subscribed
181–190 of 191 posts
Re: How companies use dark patterns to keep you subscribed
#182Earlier quoted context omitted.
I kind of agree. I think subscriptions are working for businesses because people don't like payment. And so in case of one time payment, they don't like it every single time. That's a lot of friction, and a lot of effort on the business part to convince people to come over that friction. Subscription is however, also a one-time friction, but the payment is then recurrent. That's not bad in itself, even though it's mu…
Although then it raises the problem of the payment processor (such as PayPal) having more information about you, I do like that solution. And, of course, your payment processor already knows what you're paying to who anyway, so perhaps there's no additional leakage of data with it. I was completely unaware that PayPal did this. I have a PayPal account. I think I'll investigate.
I think as of now, they know everything anyways, so this would be a simple value-add for the user.
Good luck finding the option! As far as I remember, it's at a nontrivial place, so you have to explore a bit.
Re: How companies use dark patterns to keep you subscribed
#183We need more regs about this, it's ridiculous. It's so bad that I'm completely afraid to get out my credit card for whatever reason. Thanks for putting this together but interfering with scrolling, although maybe less impactful, is probably more annoying.
I agree that the language needs to be clearer. People who want to sell are too happy to muddy waters around transactions. In the digital world, it's even muddier, for example, on Steam, as much as I love the service, I sure as hell don't "Purchase" when I click the Purchase button and pay. License maybe? Even then, the license is attached to my account, not my person.
Adobe uses the word 'save' instead of 'purchase'.
I don't see how that is legal.
Re: How companies use dark patterns to keep you subscribed
#184You know which services I don't have problems cancelling? Ones I subscribe to via Apple's in-app payments. I get that it sucks to have Apple scrape a percentage of my payments for themselves, but if you're a company I don't fully trust and/or want to have total control over my subscription without a bunch of hassle, Apple's IAPs are the way to go. Mostly this is great with the big streaming services. Want Disney+ or…
You can do this with subscriptions paid via PayPal as well.
I like my Macbook but I'm going to keep my financial transactions outside of the app store toll booths.
Re: How companies use dark patterns to keep you subscribed
#185Earlier quoted context omitted.
I typically add calendar reminders the moment I find myself signing up for something. Current reminders: Cancel Peacock by n-Date; Don't renew Tidal by foo; Downgrade YouTube premium on n;
Hmm. I have an idea. Lets make a service what would remind you about the need to cancel subscriptions. A cloud based, AI-driven service would scan your email[*] and messages[*][**] to automatically add reminders based on the purchase receipts. And of course you can always add your own reminders![**] [*] not available on the free tier, for more options check the current plans at https://dontforgettocancel.com/plans [*…
As the saga of Unroll.me[0] tells us, services like these will inevitably turn on their customers when they need to squeeze out more money than what they're charging you. Unroll.me may have been free, but as we've seen with modern SaaS, there will always be an upsell around the corner:
https://www.theverge.com/2019/12/17/21027159/unroll-me-email...
Re: How companies use dark patterns to keep you subscribed
#186As much as I think a website like this is beautiful, I always get highly annoyed when browsing stuff like this. There's a giant scrollable area with no text at the beginning, so I thought I had to click the little mac-like titlebar window buttons. When text finally appears, I have to wait for the animations before I can read. If I decide to scroll fast I lose text. My laptop fan keeps running all the time, which high…
I agree, ironic that it’s taking about bad web design when it has hard to read fonts and a Mario like character jumping around.
This is what passes for "interactivity" in this day and age. Scrolly-telling web design from NYTimes interactive style guide 2012.
Re: How companies use dark patterns to keep you subscribed
#187You know which services I don't have problems cancelling? Ones I subscribe to via Apple's in-app payments. I get that it sucks to have Apple scrape a percentage of my payments for themselves, but if you're a company I don't fully trust and/or want to have total control over my subscription without a bunch of hassle, Apple's IAPs are the way to go. Mostly this is great with the big streaming services. Want Disney+ or…
That's a good argument for requiring App Store apps to offer Apple in-app payments for anything that costs money, but not for requiring App Store apps to only accept Apple in-app payments for anything that costs money.
Good thing Apple doesn’t require App Store apps to only accept Apple in-app payments for anything that costs money. Install the Amazon app and see for yourself.
Re: How companies use dark patterns to keep you subscribed
#188Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't think you or OP or anyone else here is trying to offend. Nor do I think most people hearing the term would find it offensive. But like I said: the alternative is both more descriptive and avoids the issue. This feels like an easy one.
It’s not more descriptive, and it created the issue. The patterns aren’t just deceptive — they’re underhanded, scheming, unscrupulous, perfidious … in other words, dark. None of which has a whit to do with race.
I don't follow your point. "Dark" is obviously a much broader word that can mean many different things. It is less precise than "deceptive" and here it's being used metaphorically while "deceptive" is straightforward and literal (albeit less poetic).
Surely you would agree that someone encountering the term out of context would have a much harder time guessing what "dark patterns" means versus "deceptive patterns"?
Re: How companies use dark patterns to keep you subscribed
#189Earlier quoted context omitted.
Dear Lord, Youtube. Annoying Ad plays Saaay, we can make those ads go away, for just a little money. It's like paying the mob to make sure nothing happens to your store (by the mob)
On all Linux PC's I use uBlockOrigin (I never use windows thankfully!) and never see any ads, ever... It may be due to a combination of uBlockOrigin & uMatrix - I've not tested to know. Either way, I just never see ads, ever. I only use NewPipe to watch YouTube on mobile. Then there's the Kodi YouTube add-on - I never see any ads there either...
uBlock Origin works fine on Firefox and Chrome on desktops on any OS so it's easy to have an usable YouTube viewing experience there.
Unfortunately that doesn't go for the mobile platforms where it's basically unusable.
I wonder if the rules limiting advertising on TV (in the areas that have rules) shouldn't apply to them as well...
Re: How companies use dark patterns to keep you subscribed
#190Earlier quoted context omitted.
On all Linux PC's I use uBlockOrigin (I never use windows thankfully!) and never see any ads, ever... It may be due to a combination of uBlockOrigin & uMatrix - I've not tested to know. Either way, I just never see ads, ever. I only use NewPipe to watch YouTube on mobile. Then there's the Kodi YouTube add-on - I never see any ads there either...
uBlock Origin works fine on Firefox and Chrome on desktops on any OS so it's easy to have an usable YouTube viewing experience there. Unfortunately that doesn't go for the mobile platforms where it's basically unusable. I wonder if the rules limiting advertising on TV (in the areas that have rules) shouldn't apply to them as well...
What are you talking about, I use uBlock Origin in Firefox on Android and it works perfectly everywhere including YouTube.