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I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

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Re: I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

#181

Post by autoexec »

busterarm wrote: post #173
autoexec wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Anyone who so much as squeaked about things being wrong saw management and the union reps team up to screw the person for fucking with the status quo... Unionized workplaces can be just as toxic as any other workplace. This is true, but unlike any other workplace, if your union is filled with corruption and nepotism you can vote to change your union leadership or even to disband it entirely and replace it with a ne…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Hoffa Face prison and death? No thank you, no job has ever been worth that. Thinking that you're going to fix deep corruption via democratic process... You realize that this doesn't work in mainstream politics either, right? Only in the movies.

I don't think most worker's unions are filled with Mafia members these days so you probably wouldn't have to worry about prison/death.

As for corruption, a strong democracy is highly effective against it which is why corrupt states try so hard to weaken or eliminate Democracy where they can. Democracy is absolutely a threat to corruption.

The US does seem to have slipped some (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index) and there's no surprise that there have been some very worrying efforts to weaken our democracy recently. Most Americans think our democracy is in danger. This would probably be a good time to fight for a stronger democracy so that we're better able to deal with corruption.

Re: I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

#182

Post by ajross »

tptacek wrote: post #180
ajross wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That is not okay, in any way, shape, or form. If you want to know my view, then ask. You'd apparently be surprised to learn that i have spent lots of time and energy trying to help trans folks. It was a turn of phrase, and I apologize. The point was to poke fun at the rhetoric. And now I've read that through about three times... and I genuinely can't see what your point is? You say you don't want trans people fired…

It read to me like he was just commenting on your frustration that the law and all our norms don't instantaneously proscribe all possible forms of discrimination, that there isn't a plausible generalizable principle of "just don't discriminate", even if it's easy to anticipate that we shouldn't allow discrimination against e.g. trans people.

> there isn't a plausible generalizable principle of "just don't discriminate"

You'd at least agree that there ought to be an extremely high bar for "do not hire" exclusions like this, no?

It seems like both of you are interpreting what I wrote above in a senselessly absolutist way, which seems deeply uncharitable. I'm all for debating moral ethics in the abstract. I'm just a little horrified to see two major thought leaders on this site engaging in this particular direction.

Re: I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

#183

Post by tptacek »

ajross wrote: post #182
tptacek wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It read to me like he was just commenting on your frustration that the law and all our norms don't instantaneously proscribe all possible forms of discrimination, that there isn't a plausible generalizable principle of "just don't discriminate", even if it's easy to anticipate that we shouldn't allow discrimination against e.g. trans people.

> there isn't a plausible generalizable principle of "just don't discriminate" You'd at least agree that there ought to be an extremely high bar for "do not hire" exclusions like this, no? It seems like both of you are interpreting what I wrote above in a senselessly absolutist way, which seems deeply uncharitable. I'm all for debating moral ethics in the abstract. I'm just a little horrified to see two major thought…

Absolutely. I assume he would too. I don't have an opinion about what you wrote, but I make a habit of reading all of Berlin's comments, and it seemed like you two were just communicating at cross purposes. I'm not judging or anything.

Re: I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

#184

Post by trogdor »

theteapot wrote: post #90
biomcgary wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My first job was at a unionized workplace. I ended up doing more work to cover the guy that was loafing around under the protection of the union. Who protects you from the protectors? Rational or not, since that time, I am suspicious of the personal work ethic of those arguing for unions.

It's true, you never have to wonder about the work ethic of the unskilled and de-unionized worker. They have so little job security these days you can practically get the whip out on the poor, desperate little plebs.

I get your point, but it sounds like you forgot where you were commenting. Most of the people here work in tech and are very-high earners. Your overwhelmingly-non-unionized audience are hardly “poor, desperate little plebs.”

Re: I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

#185

Post by flangola7 »

pc86 wrote: post #172
flangola7 wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Incorrect. You still just don't like it, and will not accept that it is an accurate statement about your comment. You are not entitled to have others entertain your bad narratives.

You know you had a perfect opportunity to try to convince me, right? Show me how "don't victim blame" is a productive statement that isn't meant to just immediately shut down the discussion. Show me how it leads to more questions and more discussion instead of silence. But instead, just restating your opinion as if it is objective, unquestionable fact.

[flagged]

Re: I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

#186

Post by throw491 »

ajross wrote: post #136
DannyBee wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, this kind of "fight" is basically what society is about, and it is unfortunately always hard earned to get anywhere, but i'm also honestly not sure there is a way around this. The principle you give is essentially limitless - your "social convenience" part is doing all the work here - but you can't just define away the things you like but the majority doesn't currently accept [1] as "social convenience" wheth…

> You are essentially arguing that the right things should just take hold immediately I... don't think that's at all what I'm saying. Upthread commenter was saying that refusing to hire trans people "kind of sucks for them, but is understandable" in a pretty clear oh-well-what-you-gonna-do-about-it frame. I think that's bad. And the reason it's bad is it's the same logic deployed to serve horrific goals. I don't thin…

> reactionary gender normative compatriots

Conceptually, this isn't really an accurate depiction. Many who are critical of the belief system of gender identity are also very much against the imposition of gender norms, and will argue against transgenderism on that basis.

Re: I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

#187

Post by sizzle »

tossout367844 wrote: post #154
ryandrake wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> this person presents themselves as someone who takes a lot of effort to try and make happy. Frankly it sounds exhausting. Your comment reminds me of the Ashley Gjovik story that made the rounds on HN a few times. She was reportedly a project manager at Apple, but reading through her billion-word blog[1], it seems she spent all of her time as an activist filing complaints to regulators and fighting literally everyon…

I worked with her. She was a bully. She spent most of 2020-21 on various leaves with her fictional health and toxic workplace issues. She complained about her role so they did what she asked and now it’s listed as retaliation. She went on to report everyone who criticized her to the government for “intimidating a witness”. This woman at least seems sane.

Wow any idea what she’s up to now? I feel like doing this would be blacklisting yourself from future tech jobs industry

Re: I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

#188

Post by surgical_fire »

Hoyadonis wrote: post #160
surgical_fire wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One other thing that is great for your mental health in any job, is treating it as a job and nothing else. Something you do for 40h per week to get a salary to pay your bills. You're not there to make the world a better place, to belong to a family, to improve anything. Just do your job and go back to your life at the end of the day. When you're off work, do your best to forget about it. In fact, always prepare yours…

> You're not there to make the world a better place, to belong to a family, to improve anything. Just do your job and go back to your life at the end of the day. Speak for yourself. I do want to make the world a better place and I'm fortunate enough to have a job where I do that. It's rewarding; my life has purpose during working hours.

> Speak for yourself. I do want to make the world a better place and I'm fortunate enough to have a job where I do that. It's rewarding; my life has purpose during working hours.

That's your problem, not mine. God forbid I'm ever in such a situation.

Re: I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

#189

Post by davidguetta »

pcthrowaway wrote: post #178
davidguetta wrote: post #171

"[I] also surfaced feedback that had been shared with me by my own engineering teams regarding ways in which Rune Lab’s technology was insufficient for clinical use." "In each instance, I escalated this feedback to the appropriate members of the senior leadership team, and where appropriate, proposed refactors of common pain points. Synthesizing, evaluating, and sharing this feedback is a crucial component of any TPM…

We only have the worker protections we have because at some point people chose to take a stand rather than just change jobs because it was easier.

Ok for discriminations.. but criticiszing internal procedures being annoying about it and raising concerns all the timebhas nothing to do with worker protection.. you are just being a weight for the managements and just not worth the money

Re: I was laid off in retaliation for anti-discrimination whistleblowing

#190

Post by bragr »

sizzle wrote: post #187
tossout367844 wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked with her. She was a bully. She spent most of 2020-21 on various leaves with her fictional health and toxic workplace issues. She complained about her role so they did what she asked and now it’s listed as retaliation. She went on to report everyone who criticized her to the government for “intimidating a witness”. This woman at least seems sane.

Wow any idea what she’s up to now? I feel like doing this would be blacklisting yourself from future tech jobs industry

Not just tech jobs I'd think.
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