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Available Today: Windows Dev Kit 2023 a.k.a. Project Volterra

blogs.windows.com

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Re: Available Today: Windows Dev Kit 2023 a.k.a. Project Volterra

#181

Post by myko »

ramesh31 wrote: post #32
IndigoIncognito wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd argue that Microsoft entering the mobile OS market is worse than having a duopoly

>I'd argue that Microsoft entering the mobile OS market is worse than having a duopoly We need something. I’ve lost all faith in the hardware direction of iPhone. The 14 Pro (let alone Pro Max) is an absurd monstrosity. And Google clearly has no interest in innovation beyond copying Apple.

> And Google clearly has no interest in innovation beyond copying Apple.

I disagree, I think both platforms have copied plenty from one another. I used to jailbreak my iOS devices to get similar functionality to Android. Hasn't been necessary for awhile, I feel like the platforms are near parity now, but claiming one is copying the other (with no reciprocity) seems farfetched.

Re: Available Today: Windows Dev Kit 2023 a.k.a. Project Volterra

#182

Post by Wohlf »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #155
Sakos wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a chicken or the egg dilemma. Non-Apple ARM is too slow, so nobody wants Windows ARM, and nobody wants Windows ARM, so nobody is seriously working on consumer-targeted ARM. It will probably fail because Microsoft is generally bad at managing and marketing their hardware projects and coordinating with manufacturers and retail partners. Also, yeah, the pricing and performance is abysmal. But there is some sense to…

> Microsoft is generally bad at managing and marketing their hardware projects and coordinating with manufacturers and retail partners X-Box would beg to differ since 2002.

Surface products as well.

Re: Available Today: Windows Dev Kit 2023 a.k.a. Project Volterra

#183

Post by VTimofeenko »

smoldesu wrote: post #137
osigurdson wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d like to be able to run Windows on mac M series.

Or full-featured Linux, for that matter.

Arm64 vms seem to be working great. And pretty soon Asahi will get to the point of being completely usable as a daily driver

Re: Available Today: Windows Dev Kit 2023 a.k.a. Project Volterra

#184

Post by rr888 »

awill wrote: post #78

The difference here is that the M1 in the M1 mac mini is faster than Apple's phone SoC (the A16). The Qualcomm 8cx gen 3 (what a terrible name) in this machine is NOT faster than even Qualcomm's phone SoC (the 8 gen 1), let alone Apple's phone SoC. It's absurd to be selling a desktop PC that's weaker than a phone.

Firstly its a dev kit, not a retail product.

But most people only need a browser and maybe a few simple products anyway. A phone SoC is probably enough.

Re: Available Today: Windows Dev Kit 2023 a.k.a. Project Volterra

#185

Post by xen2xen1 »

ramesh31 wrote: post #32
IndigoIncognito wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd argue that Microsoft entering the mobile OS market is worse than having a duopoly

>I'd argue that Microsoft entering the mobile OS market is worse than having a duopoly We need something. I’ve lost all faith in the hardware direction of iPhone. The 14 Pro (let alone Pro Max) is an absurd monstrosity. And Google clearly has no interest in innovation beyond copying Apple.

GP is probably one of the "small phone people" to hazard a guess.

Re: Available Today: Windows Dev Kit 2023 a.k.a. Project Volterra

#186

Post by ramesh31 »

perardi wrote: post #107
ramesh31 wrote: post #9

Could this be the harbinger of a return to Windows Phone? The world sorely needs an alternative to the mobile OS duopoly.

Why? (And let’s set aside the how they’d possibly be able to compete with the scale, market penetration, marketing spend, and mature app ecosystems of iOS/Android and Apple/Samsung.) Privacy? Lack of advertising? Respect for the user’s choices? From the company that brought you Windows 11? Why does the world sorely need another closed-source operating system full of telemetry?

>Privacy? Lack of advertising? Respect for the user’s choices? From the company that brought you Windows 11? Why does the world sorely need another closed-source operating system full of telemetry?

Hardware. I want a Surface Phone.

Re: Available Today: Windows Dev Kit 2023 a.k.a. Project Volterra

#187

Post by caycep »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #122
awill wrote: post #78

The difference here is that the M1 in the M1 mac mini is faster than Apple's phone SoC (the A16). The Qualcomm 8cx gen 3 (what a terrible name) in this machine is NOT faster than even Qualcomm's phone SoC (the 8 gen 1), let alone Apple's phone SoC. It's absurd to be selling a desktop PC that's weaker than a phone.

I'll be curious to see benchmarks but it would be funny if Windows for ARM running in Parallels on an M1 MacBook Air ends up being a better dev machine than an official Windows for ARM dev box produced by Microsoft.

on Vmware fusion tech preview...can't say I've pushed its performance, but it is really quite smooth so far...

Re: Available Today: Windows Dev Kit 2023 a.k.a. Project Volterra

#189

Post by rchaud »

dtx1 wrote: post #90

And here's the difference between Microsoft and Apple: When Apple switches to ARM, people believe them. When Microsoft switches to arm, people ignore them. Why? Because Microsoft only ever half-asses such changes (see the terrible SOC in this).

I think another considerable difference is that Windows global footprint is 10x that of MacOS, so Microsoft has to keep both backwards compatibility and OEM's production plans in mind.

There is nothing for people to believe or not believe. MS cannot cannot discontinue x86 overnight because their OS is used by a much larger proportion of the world.

Re: Available Today: Windows Dev Kit 2023 a.k.a. Project Volterra

#190

Post by Kranar »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #155
Sakos wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a chicken or the egg dilemma. Non-Apple ARM is too slow, so nobody wants Windows ARM, and nobody wants Windows ARM, so nobody is seriously working on consumer-targeted ARM. It will probably fail because Microsoft is generally bad at managing and marketing their hardware projects and coordinating with manufacturers and retail partners. Also, yeah, the pricing and performance is abysmal. But there is some sense to…

> Microsoft is generally bad at managing and marketing their hardware projects and coordinating with manufacturers and retail partners X-Box would beg to differ since 2002.

XBox is a great example of horrible mismanagement that cost Microsoft many billions of dollars, was almost abandoned, and went through a very rocky path to get to where it is today which is still frankly not that great of a position (it lags behind Switch and Playstation):

https://www.shacknews.com/article/121384/last-one-at-the-tab...

Don Mattrick almost tanked that entire product and it survives today because Phil Spencer miraculously managed to turn it around after all of the previous leadership was forced out of the company.

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