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Get in zoomer, we're saving React

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Re: Get in zoomer, we're saving React

#181

Post by Existenceblinks »

skydhash wrote: post #120
Existenceblinks wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Logic-less template is ok despite some having loop because semantically, users also want to list things, add a thing to a list. I wouldn't add `if/else` but switch-case (this simulates category in user space, not complex condition). "Local variable" shouldn't be exposed to users. Collection name is ok. I think Shopify's Liquid is good, they just can't figure out decent UX on top of it.

A logic-less template is easily done, by exposing a few methods to the programmer providing the data. I remember Android XMLs to be logic-less and while it refers to concrete classes, something like this could easily be adapted to generate text. A designer wouldn’t need conditionals or loops because he could mark something as a container, the goes on to design the content (for loop, each cell). Desktop and Mobile had…

I have this idea in mind, how do think about 1 AST 3 different UIs? Content editor, Developer, Designer. Each expose different things but shared AST. Because I think 1 UI with mixed bag contracts is not going to do it.

Re: Get in zoomer, we're saving React

#182

Post by tuukkah »

Rapzid wrote: post #170
tuukkah wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, JSX (and React) is interesting in this way: it's not a (full) template language. Instead, it's a convenient way to write component fragments that include HTML/XML expressions and further components. Each component top-level is still JavaScript statements. There's also an escape hatch to include arbitrary JS expressions inside your JSX expressions, although perhaps we should use it only to include variables and n…

JSX is a Javascript syntax extension.

Yes, and? Did I not differentiate appropriately between JS and JSX expressions?

Re: Get in zoomer, we're saving React

#183

Post by kitsunesoba »

ripe wrote: post #147
amelius wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can never find the back button on iOS.

Is there a back button? Honest question. I thought iPhones didn't have one. When I pick up my wife's iPhone I always feel a little lost.

As someone who mostly uses iOS and occasionally Android, I’ve had difficulty integrating the Android back button into my usage. Because its behavior within apps is defined by devs, I feel like I never have a grip on what to expect when using it (sometimes it’ll close a sheet, sometimes it won’t, etc) and adding inter-app navigation muddles that further. Every time I try I end up enabling the iOS style gesture bar at the bottom.

Re: Get in zoomer, we're saving React

#184

Post by wildrhythms »

tartoran wrote: post #167
nathias wrote: post #98

I'm a React dev, I wish I could be working with svelte.

What stops you though?

Most likely an immense existing app with some gigantic library of React components... I still work on a React app with class-based components so complicated that nobody wants to touch. Like, componentDidUpdate() is hundreds of lines of spaghetti code kicking off even more setStates. Even some of the newer hooks-based components are a maze of side-effects... effects kicking off other effects, triggering a memo, triggering another memo. It's a mess, and management does not have 'tech debt' in their vocabulary.

Re: Get in zoomer, we're saving React

#185

Post by mattgreenrocks »

LtWorf wrote: post #94
b0afc375b5 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't read the article, but just based on the passages you have quoted and based on my recent experience, I will have to agree with the author. I recently learned that GitHub has a discussions page which is separate from the issues pages. To pass the time and to give back to the community I try to help people and answer their questions. It's a bit concerning to me that when I point some people to the right directi…

> I recently learned that GitHub has a discussions page which is separate from the issues pages. The people who are good won't be using that. When I was a student working on my thesis I realised I was too advanced to ask questions on stackoverflow and I would not be receiving useful help there. My issues were too uncommon and specific, because the simple ones that stackoverflow is good at solving were not blocking me…

The fun of programming begins at the point that stackoverflow/Google begins to cease providing ready-made answers.

Re: Get in zoomer, we're saving React

#186

Post by dhalucario »

genezeta wrote: post #90

This article is kind of sad. In part because it comes from its author, who usually writes interesting stuff. But this one is ranty -and no, it doesn't make me angry. It's ranty and also fluffy, light in content, scarce in any arguments or conclusions other than "youth these days! they don't even try!". I'm not young and I still find this article poor. After going through the first two thirds of the article with mostl…

Also: Why can't and won't you try dancing?

Re: Get in zoomer, we're saving React

#187

Post by h0l0cube »

hantusk wrote: post #140

When reading through the comments here, I really feel like the article was misunderstood. My summary of the article is: Point 1: React solved all the right things, but its current trajectory, does not prioritize developing the fundamental tooling we need. React does not allow us to build a new Figma (consistent undo/redo in collaborative settings, immediate low-latency mutation of app state to reflect user changes an…

> React does not allow us to build a new Figma (consistent undo/redo in collaborative settings, immediate low-latency mutation of app state to reflect user changes and building fundamentals to SaaS interoperability)

If I wanted to write the next Figma, the first thing I’d reach for is Phoenix Liveview + Channels with Vaxine/AntidoteDB or some other eventually consistent CRDT store for collaborative editing and host it on fly.io - I’d forgo the ‘front end’ completely

Re: Get in zoomer, we're saving React

#188

Post by ex3ndr »

stasm wrote: post #46

> When you rename or move a file that you're editing, its window instantly reflects the new name and location. How does macOS achieve its reactivity? Is it two-way bindings? Events/messages? Immediate mode re-renders?

Nothing really, pretty much the same as WIN32 api. May be added event bus is somehow faster than simple few-line-invent-at-home implementation.

Re: Get in zoomer, we're saving React

#189

Post by makeitdouble »

> The very notion of "back-end" is a fallacy: it implies that one can produce a useful, working system, without ever having to talk to end-users.

This is a small part of the rant, but he is fundamentally mistaken about what backends are. The real life equivalents are not bridges, but kitchens or back-offices: a place where you make the sausage so that the customer can have a delightful experience without the gory business part in sight.

It’s not disconnected from end-users, quite he opposite, as it’s suppose to realize the core value of the product.

I don’t agree with a lot of other parts of the rant either, but the global message of “react needs to evolve in a different direction” is I think interesting.

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