EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted • Hacker News Board

Re: EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted

#181

Post by eyelidlessness » Mon, Sep 05, 2022, 4:09 AM UTC

crooked-v wrote: post #147

eyelidlessness wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As both a cyclist and pedestrian, I definitely prefer bikes off the sidewalk. Even conscientious cyclists who call “on your left” or whatever routinely underestimate the necessary reaction time and overestimate how far their voice will carry. Even if they get both of those right, they’ve frequently terrified my pup by just being faster and louder and larger than anything on foot she’s ever met. I’ve had to return hom…

> separated bike infrastructure > drivers trying to navigate it Well, there's your problem - it's not actually separated.

Yep, that is exactly my problem.

Re: EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted

#182

Post by cfeduke » Mon, Sep 05, 2022, 4:09 AM UTC

jnwatson wrote: post #54

guidedlight wrote: post #8

Given EV’s should have price parity with ICE by 2025-2027, I think its obvious that EV adoption should accelerate. Unless you are purchasing a very cheap sub-$20k car, EV’s should become the only choice by 2030. https://insideevs.com/news/506465/evs-price-parity-europe-20...

I had the misfortune of renting a Tesla right before a severe cold snap in Virginia. I was charging at 4 miles an hour at the public charging station. I’m not sure I would buy an EV in an area where it stays below freezing for weeks at a time.

That's crazy. I've had my Model 3 in northern Virginia for over four years. Charging at any Tesla charger has always been quick, freezing cold still 100+ miles in 20 minutes. Charging at the free chargers at the grocery store with an adapter in the dead of winter isn't the fastest, but it's always greater than four miles per hour.

The only car temperature problem I've had in the winter in Virginia hasn't been with an EV at all - just a VW diesel that had trouble starting due to extreme cold.

Re: EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted

#183

Post by reaperducer » Mon, Sep 05, 2022, 4:13 AM UTC

sandworm101 wrote: post #84

ThunderSizzle wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your facts are inconvenient and will probably just be dismissed sadly. EVs need to win by being better without more risk, not by trying to ban people currently using ICEs.

More inconvenient facts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Fort_McMurray_wildfire https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E_OLgC4nV0 88,000 people in perhaps 50,000 vehicles all taking the ONE road out of town. Some kind companies setup fuel trucks by the roadside to top up tanks. Gas delivery can be scaled up and even made portable in an emergency. Had those 50,000 vehicles all been EVs, tens of thousands of people would…

88,000 people in perhaps 50,000 vehicles all taking the ONE road out of town.

That's an interesting point.

We see this a couple of times a year in the United States — tens, or even hundreds of thousands of people evacuating because of an approaching hurricane.

It takes hours and hours and hours to go not very far. And when you finally get someplace with an open hotel room, it's hundreds of miles away.

Although I believe they are close, I'm not sure EVs are ready for that challenge yet. Especially since a gas station half-way to safety can fill up hundreds of cars faster than a dozen EVs can charge.

Can more chargers solve this problem? Better chargers? Both? Something else?

Re: EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted

#184

Post by fomine3 » Mon, Sep 05, 2022, 4:13 AM UTC

sandworm101 wrote: post #78

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also an EV has more battery capacity than my house so it'd be pretty hard to charge a car in the winter when I can barely keep my house batteries running my house. Not sure if you're just talking about something specific to your house, or making a broader point. Once EVs are widespread, they can add a huge amount of storage capacity to the grid. Not hard to imagine utility and government incentives that encourage c…

I'm not convinced. The "smart grid" has been discussed for over a decade. Would anyone here allow their Tesla to discharge when parked, allow it to feed power back into the grid? What if those extra charge/discharge cycles decreases the battery's life expectancy? The small bonus payments (pennies) just won't cut it imho. People will charge their cars and keep them charged.

As we saw in Europe and Texas, electricity price could get insane extremely high for a short time so possibly power grid operator pays more. A problem is that some people want to hoard electricity on their vehicle in such situation.

Re: EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted

#185

Post by mechanical_bear » Mon, Sep 05, 2022, 4:14 AM UTC

anonporridge wrote: post #117

rootusrootus wrote: post #27

I have owned a Tesla, and I leased my wife a Bolt a while back. She's convinced, I'm convinced, but with the lease coming to an end next year we probably will not replace the Bolt with another EV. Why? Prices. I was ready to buy a Mach E, but then Ford raised the price something like 6 grand while simultaneously losing the $7500 tax credit. That effectively bumps the price of the car into a territory I don't think ma…

I've seen Rav4 Primes selling for $20k over the $50k premium MSRP. They're not in a better place than regular EVs.

Except you can get them for MSRP at many dealers, for example: Sunnyvale Toyota.

Re: EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted

#186

Post by seltzered_ » Mon, Sep 05, 2022, 4:15 AM UTC

endisneigh wrote: post #74

I love EVs. That being said I wish someone would make an enclosed bicycle/motorcycle that costs less than $2000. Something like that which can go 30mph and had space for 2 days of groceries would be enough for me to eliminate my car all together. I'm cobbling something similar now with a Class 3 cargo ebike, but rain sucks =/ The idealist in me says that electric ebikes could eliminate most of Americas problems in on…

more than $2000, but https://www.litmotors.com/ was trying to do an enclosed self-balancing two-wheeler for a decade (their Founder/CEO has a pretty bad injury a few years ago) - supposedly they're reforming but we'll see.

Re: EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted

#187

Post by therealrootuser » Mon, Sep 05, 2022, 4:15 AM UTC

As someone that is currently in the market for a new car, I would love to get an EV, but I also don't have a good way to charge. Seems like most EV owners just charge at their house, but what about people that don't have access to a good power tap? (apartment dwellers, renters, etc.)

Sometimes it feels like there is a group of EV elites out there that are predicting the complete demise of ICEs while conveniently downplaying the problem of charging access. I live on the outskirts of a major metro area. I've looked at the charging maps, and there just aren't good chargers available right now. I really hope that chargers will become ubiquitous in my area in the future, but until that happens, I don't have a great choice.

And so, my next car is going to just be a standard ICE hybrid. I hope that will be the last ICE I have to buy, but for right now, an EV seems like it is just not quite practical for me.

Re: EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted

#188

Post by mechanical_bear » Mon, Sep 05, 2022, 4:17 AM UTC

noirbot wrote: post #160

sephamorr wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting perspective. Another view: solar panels on your roof, using your car battery for your house nighttime needs means that during doomsday your energy intensive lifestyle doesn't have to change at all.

Ah yes, the roof of my building where I'm on a middle floor. I'll start lobbying the board to install solar for just me to use. The problem with a lot of this is that the more "responsible" you're already living, the less reasonable the next "responsible" thing is to do. Going solar/off grid is only really possible if you live on a lot of land where you're the only resident, which is otherwise generally not recommend…

> if you live on a lot of land where you're the only resident, which is otherwise generally not recommended

By whom? In my case, I am not the only resident, I have a large family on our acreage.

Re: EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted

#189

Post by nradov » Mon, Sep 05, 2022, 4:21 AM UTC

JKCalhoun wrote: post #59

ant6n wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love the idea of an EV, but ultimately it’s just extending a pretty unsustainable car culture involving the allocation of half of urban space to individuals moving around 1~2 tons of metal in order to do trips that would be much shorter with better designed cities, while letting walking, cycling and transit languish.

Agree. If EV, I prefer electric bikes/scooters. Especially that crazy swappable battery thing they have in Singapore ( https://news.yahoo.com/trial-battery-swap-charge-stations-el... ). To be sure, in the U.S., you would probably still need a car in winter, rain... To that end, the wife and I are down to a single car we share between the two of us. (Seems like such a radical thing to do in the U.S. for some reason.)

I don't know if it's radical, but having a single car stops being practical as soon as your two kids have to be at different sports tournaments 100 miles apart. Sure in theory you can rent another car when you need it, but in practice it's such a hassle that unless you're short of parking spaces it's easier to own 2 cars.

Re: EV adoption in US is happening faster than predicted

#190

Post by yurishimo » Mon, Sep 05, 2022, 4:21 AM UTC

reaperducer wrote: post #183

sandworm101 wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More inconvenient facts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Fort_McMurray_wildfire https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E_OLgC4nV0 88,000 people in perhaps 50,000 vehicles all taking the ONE road out of town. Some kind companies setup fuel trucks by the roadside to top up tanks. Gas delivery can be scaled up and even made portable in an emergency. Had those 50,000 vehicles all been EVs, tens of thousands of people would…

88,000 people in perhaps 50,000 vehicles all taking the ONE road out of town. That's an interesting point. We see this a couple of times a year in the United States — tens, or even hundreds of thousands of people evacuating because of an approaching hurricane. It takes hours and hours and hours to go not very far. And when you finally get someplace with an open hotel room, it's hundreds of miles away. Although I beli…

At a minimum we need some sort of fast charger that can add 50+ miles in 5 minutes. Granted, in a gas car that's a full tank usually, but let's be reasonable about what we can expect in the near-ish future.

Having wireless tech that can charge that fast would be even better. Maybe get on a little conveyer belt similar to an automated carwash and by the time you exit, you have 50 more miles than before. Hell, imagine these things running parallel to a road like a pit lane on a racetrack. Move on the track for 5 minutes, then they turn around and grab cars going the opposite direction.

Seems pretty inefficient and probably a logistical nightmare, but it would be cool to see it work!