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Toyota RAV4 Prime hybrid SUV now selling for 48% over MSRP

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Re: Toyota RAV4 Prime hybrid SUV now selling for 48% over MSRP

#181

If it's selling for so much does that mean Toyota (the company) is missing out on a ton of margin that the dealerships are making?

For that money the Lexus NX 450h+ is probably viable. And would probably hold a higher resale due to the Lexus badge.

lol, no. If you pay a massive markup over msrp, you've just lit that money on fire when things normalize and you go to sell.

Re: Toyota RAV4 Prime hybrid SUV now selling for 48% over MSRP

#182

RAV4 Prime looks good. I probably should plug its competitors: Hyundai Tucson PHEV and Ford Escape PHEV. They're cheaper and roughly the same size. They don't have the insane acceleration of the RAV4 prime, but they accomplish the goal of going from A-to-B with 40ish miles of all electric range + gasoline backup. If you're willing to sacrifice the acceleration, the Hyundai Tucson PHEV should be competitive. Ford Esca…

Sub 8 second 0-60 is needed on backlane country roads to enable safe passing.

Having said that, I mainly drive on city streets and interstates now days, but I still understand why someone would want a car with a little pep.

Funny how EVs have changed the game on performance. I don't think anyone sells an EV with a 0-60 over 8s, and one can pretty easily get a model 3 with ~ 3s 0-60. That was supercar territory not so long ago.

Re: Toyota RAV4 Prime hybrid SUV now selling for 48% over MSRP

#183

RAV4 Prime looks good. I probably should plug its competitors: Hyundai Tucson PHEV and Ford Escape PHEV. They're cheaper and roughly the same size. They don't have the insane acceleration of the RAV4 prime, but they accomplish the goal of going from A-to-B with 40ish miles of all electric range + gasoline backup. If you're willing to sacrifice the acceleration, the Hyundai Tucson PHEV should be competitive. Ford Esca…

Very happy with the Escape. I thought I’d miss the 4WD but honestly the one time I drive to the mountains or something is usually in May-September and FWD is perfectly fine for that in the PNW. The 40 mile range is amazing for a mild climate commute and driving around the city. I still haven’t added any gas and I’ve had it for 6 months. I considered the Prime but I cared much more about the price and getting one this…

My only concern with PHEVs is that gas goes stale. That gasoline in your tank has now started to undergo all manner of nasty transformations that will clog fuel injectors, ruin fuel pumps, etc.

It can be combated somewhat with fuel stabilizers, but it's absolutely a concern.

Re: Toyota RAV4 Prime hybrid SUV now selling for 48% over MSRP

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very happy with the Escape. I thought I’d miss the 4WD but honestly the one time I drive to the mountains or something is usually in May-September and FWD is perfectly fine for that in the PNW. The 40 mile range is amazing for a mild climate commute and driving around the city. I still haven’t added any gas and I’ve had it for 6 months. I considered the Prime but I cared much more about the price and getting one this…

My only concern with PHEVs is that gas goes stale. That gasoline in your tank has now started to undergo all manner of nasty transformations that will clog fuel injectors, ruin fuel pumps, etc. It can be combated somewhat with fuel stabilizers, but it's absolutely a concern.

It takes months for gas to go stale though.

Just "don't charge" your PHEV once or twice, and you'll cycle through the gasoline. Pretend its an ICE vehicle about once every 3 to 6 months and you should be fine.

You probably have a road trip / beach trip where you were planning to use its gasoline tank anyway in that timeframe. You only need to travel ~300 miles to cycle through most of your gas tank.

Re: Toyota RAV4 Prime hybrid SUV now selling for 48% over MSRP

#185
post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This number is only factoring gas as a energy source. Wow, that's great! I didn't realize ICE tech has improved so much. That's better than a new little Ford Fiesta, weighing nearly half as much.

Small hybrids like a Prius can go over 50 mpg consistently. Hybrids are so good from a gas standpoint. At these gas prices, it’s a no brainer to get a hybrid IMO.

Why don't they use these engines in standard cars? Or are there some shenanigans involved that do require some electrical power?

Re: Toyota RAV4 Prime hybrid SUV now selling for 48% over MSRP

#186
post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And a service center can't turn that Ferrari into a Camry, either.

What nonsense are you talking about? This sort of stuff happens in construction all the time. If the wrong materials get delivered to you site they absolutely can and will come take what you didn't pay for and bring you the correct materials. Same thing if any enterprise hardware or software is provisioned incorrectly. Same thing with telecom. Same thing with cars. If the wrong car gets dropped off they can and absol…

> If the wrong materials get delivered to you site they absolutely can and will come take what you didn't pay for and bring you the correct materials.

Will they tear down the building built with those materials 3 years ago to do it?

Re: Toyota RAV4 Prime hybrid SUV now selling for 48% over MSRP

#187
post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Small hybrids like a Prius can go over 50 mpg consistently. Hybrids are so good from a gas standpoint. At these gas prices, it’s a no brainer to get a hybrid IMO.

Why don't they use these engines in standard cars? Or are there some shenanigans involved that do require some electrical power?

You need the “electrical” aspect to get these efficiencies. There’s a couple aspect of it that gives it a great mpg. Engines naturally have a range of rpm and load that makes it extremely fuel efficient (worse to best can be over a 20% difference). Traditional car makers tune this to be around 60 mph since that’s the typical cruising speed of the average American. With a hybrid, you can force the engine to run at this optimal performance regardless of speed. Second aspect is regenerative braking which recovers a nontrivial amount. Lastly, with a electrical motor, you can tune the acceleration curve to use more electrical motor more than the engine to reduce acceleration deficiencies. FWIW, most hybrids sold in the US (maybe globally?) are not pluggable. It has an engine, electric motor, generator, and a very very small battery pack but standard hybrids are not pluggable (they never touch an outlet).

Re: Toyota RAV4 Prime hybrid SUV now selling for 48% over MSRP

#188
post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you read the comments, you'd have seen the analogy to Apple repairing a laptop with slightly better parts and then deciding multiple years later to software-nerf it. I don't know about you, but I'd be livid - in both cases.

You would be livid you got exactly what you paid for?

In this analogy, I paid for the full hardware. That Apple or Tesla didn't charge some previous owner ain't my concern.

Re: Toyota RAV4 Prime hybrid SUV now selling for 48% over MSRP

#190
post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla honors the price you order your Model Y at. Mine took about 3 months to get and the price did go up once during that time. I paid the original price. Fun surprise ordering a Mach-E/F-150 Lightning and the dealer charges the market adjustment on your custom ordered car. No where is that fee disclosed until you go down to the dealership to pick it up.

Eh, that doesn't even seem legal? Unless it's in a contract somewhere in very very small text.

as I've heard, they will order the car for you, but you only sign/pay for it when it has arrived.

I guess due to demand and regular price increases, they don't need to worry about customers bailing out, and they can keep adding to their margin as the market rises

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