Surveillance is for children. Search without warrants is to keep us safe from drugs. War is for peace and democracy.
How much can politicians, activists and beaurocrats pervert the truth?
EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications
181–190 of 431 posts
Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications
#182Earlier quoted context omitted.
My understanding of this technology was it was usually a hash or fingerprint of some form of the material, to be compared against a database of hashes of known-bad material. I doubt EU countries have the infrastructure or budget to run models across everything, no?
The problem with hashes is, that you cannot prove what the original image was without actually getting caught with csam. So basically, a whistleblower takes photos of some very incriminating documents, someone gets accused of eg. money laundering, hashes of those images get added to the "csam" database, and you find the first person (via metadata) who had that image on their phone. Also, in some more repressive count…
But would the system not insist images are hashed by it? I mean; I would think it’s not a weird demand that if this is to protect children (which it is not, at least not only) that the image hashes are solely for that purpose or otherwise not valid and thrown out by at least an AI. I know it’s naive but it seems you want the image with the hash and if someone gets flagged and it’s some money laundering doc, then it should be dismissed before you get out on a list.
Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications
#183Earlier quoted context omitted.
Unfortunately, here's what will really happen: 5:30am, loud knock at the door. You open the door a crack to see who it is. Cops bust in. You're immediately handcuffed and sat outside. Cops take anything with a screen, usb plug, etc. All your media. All your computers. All your external hard drives. Every one of these devices will be imaged, and archived prior to being searched. The data will be kept for years, to pro…
That won’t happen here but sure, US type of police overreach makes a better soundbite with horribly vague proposals like this. And people should be scared so I guess it’s good; maybe they will protest (probably not though because the children the children).
Stuff quite similar to that happens in Germany[1]. Where is "here"?
[1] https://www.ccc.de/de/updates/2018/hausdurchsuchungen-bei-ve...
Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications
#184It's scary, because CSAM (child sexual abuse material) is very, very broad, and quite vague in its definition¹. My three year old son stayed with my parents for a week, and he was being taught to swim in their swimming pool. Of course, I get sent pictures and clips of his progress by a proud grandma, and of course, him being a toddler, he felt swimming trunks to be completely optional (and of course, they are at his…
> The automated filter won't care about the context though That's why we have a justice system. Specifically not a common law based one, which is kinds scary per se. People are innocent until proven guilty and the burden of proof's on the prosecution. We are talking about EU here, not Sudan.
1. What makes you think Sudan (or NK, or Russia, or China) won't get their hands on this technology?
2. What makes you think every government in the entire EU will always have the people's best interests at heart?
3. What makes you think #2 is true even today?
It seems like this technology could be very easy to abuse, to great public detriment. Is the juice worth the squeeze?
Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications
#185Earlier quoted context omitted.
Then encryption becomes evidence of guilt, unless you give up the key so they can search it to make sure you're not guilty.
Yeah also not, they will need to have proof of at least connections with some criminal networks to compel you to do that.
Parallel construction though.
Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications
#186It's scary, because CSAM (child sexual abuse material) is very, very broad, and quite vague in its definition¹. My three year old son stayed with my parents for a week, and he was being taught to swim in their swimming pool. Of course, I get sent pictures and clips of his progress by a proud grandma, and of course, him being a toddler, he felt swimming trunks to be completely optional (and of course, they are at his…
The biggest problem is that these images are CSAM. Or at least a bit-for-bit identical image is in a different context. If it is family members are sharing an image of their child having fun or even sending an image to your doctor then there is no problem here. But those exact images in a different context could be a problem.
Of course this is why they have human moderation before conviction. But I absolutely don't want my private images being reviewed because they may be CSAM. This is basically assuming that I have likely done something wrong and intruding my privacy because of that.
Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications
#187So we need to always use a VPN - got it.
Yes, till they are legal.
Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications
#188Are they cooperating with the UK; seems there were a lot of requests for proposals from them during covid with millions attached to scan e2e connections and other csam measures.
Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications
#189Earlier quoted context omitted.
Grateful why? They served to restrict our rights.
Because EU recogniced certifcates made travel within the EU possible and, besides some funny rules for border crossings, almost pain free. Just imagine going from Geany to France would require to get your German vaccination certificate recognised by the French first, as one example.
> Just imagine going from Geany to France would require to get your German vaccination certificate recognised by the French first, as one example.
Just imagine going from A to B without having to show a useless certificate.
Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications
#190Earlier quoted context omitted.
Let's not forget banning curtains. Only clean, transparent windows should be allowed.
Are you sure that's enough? Maybe homes should be built out of fully transparent materials. Don't want any internal rooms to hide in.
... which is exactly the setting of We by Yevgeny Zamyatin, the novel that inspired 1984.