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If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

abhinavsharma.com

181–190 of 471 posts

Re: If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

#181
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nobody is coming along with a better search engine https://neeva.com/ better than pretty much any solution (Qwant, DDG, etc) I've personally tested. It also indexes specific websites like StackOverflow, GitHub, and GMail. Edit: Neeva does require an account to create because eventually the product is going to require a subscription.

"See results for ' ' Create your free Neeva account." "To continue searching and access all of Neeva's features, create your free account. Already a Neeva member? Sign in" Yeah, no.

I get that.

But essentially we all have de facto accounts on Google anyway.

They track and monitor usage and then map you to a user account when you finally login somewhere.

I'm totally fine with that being upfront and made clear from the get go!

Re: If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

#182

The “google search sucks” rhetoric is getting a bit old. It works really really well and is free. I rarely ever have issues with it. I think it’s just getting trendy to dog on

I agree.

People have forgotten that Google searches for tech stuff 10 years ago used to exclusively returns results from sites like Experts Exchange with solutions behind paywalls. I'm glad Google did something about that. And, of course, thankful that sites like Stack Overflow came along.

Re: If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

#183
post #147

The author missed the most important reason that Google search results often suck: tens of thousands of people are working very hard to make it suck. They call themselves "SEO specialists", and their job is to get their shitty site to the top of the rankings. It's an ongoing battle. Sure, Google wants to make money, but to do that they need to protect their search moneymaker and keep it dominant, so their incentive i…

Search isn’t Google’s moneymaker, advertising is. And those shitty SEO’d sites are choc-a-bloc with advertising. Google has little incentive to downrank them.

Search is their main gateway to the advertising dollars. "Google it" is synonymous with any search regardless of the engine being used.

Re: If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

#184
post #158
post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google could double its usefulness overnight just by bringing this back. It is now evident Google is not in the business of making its search any better.

Which is why we need more competitors in this space. When you are an underdog, making something "better" even for no direct monetisation path, is an obvious win because it all creates more noise and attracts people to your platform. More noise = more business - but Google don't need more noise, they have all the attention they need, they are basically king, they just need to figure out how to milk it, which means the…

Where should the profit come from for a search-oriented product/business?

Re: If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

#185
There are so many websites, apps and media services that are slowly being affected by what I call "information ochlocracy", where those types of organizations which rely on large numbers of people for their existence, will naturally start to target the widest audience/viewership/user base, and the quality of the service as a whole suffer as a result.

Here's the law: "The value of information is inversely proportional to the size of its intended audience." And its correlary: "The wider the audience, the less valuable a piece of information will need to be." These both stem from the basic premise that accurate information is more valuable the more scarce it is.

What this creates basically is a situation in which the quality, depth and timeliness of a piece of information or media service will, over time, always tend towards the most broadly applicable content, despite being less and less specifically useful.

In Google's case we can use cars as an example. Ideally, depending on the exact search term, you might want results providing information about buying them or maybe fixing them. However, maybe more advertising money can be made from using that search term to sell Forza or Gran Turismo video games, so the algorithms will detect this and shift accordingly. And since these games are being talked about on social media a lot, the algorithms pick that up too. Maybe some news mentioned the car or a celebrity bought one. The result might be that you're scrolling through ads from Microsoft and Sony, online shopping results of all the related gaming products, summaries of tweets about it, news snippets, etc., and almost nothing about what you were originally looking for. Searches for historical events like Pearl Harbor could have you scrolling past movie reviews before you finally get to a Wikipedia link.

Ochlocracy is mob rule. It's the evil flip side of democracy, in which people actively make a choice based on considered opinions. In an ochlocracy, the choice is made by the whims of the mob as a whole, and they themselves don't even know the choices they're making. As Google and other companies optimize their services, the numbers will always lead to targeting the largest swath of people and as a result the overall quality naturally suffers.

There's more to this, but this is the general problem. In order to keep growing from now on, every year Google's overall quality will have to suffer in order to be more applicable to larger numbers of people.

Re: If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

#186
post #40

Honestly I think people are completely underestimating the difficulty of a good search engine. Google was better ten years ago because search was an easier problem to solve back then. End of story. Nobody is coming along with a better search engine. There is too much spam, content gaming, and money to be made by hacking search. These posts should almost be blocked from hacker news. ITs a fantasy. Its like saying that…

No. Google is an actively hostile experience. Try it without adblock and get a taste of how most people get treated by Google. And for the search results, Kagi is already better for 90% of my queries. It's much more difficult now to build a competitive search engine, but saying it's impossible and discussions should be banned is toxic. (And already basically proven wrong with existing competing search engines.)

I use Google without AdBlock on my phone daily and it's not quite that different.

Re: If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

#187
post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mentioned things I hadn't thought of. Google's Search accomplishes the goals of 10 years ago, but steps no further than that. It treats its power users like kids, and offers no complex filtering to do things like removing search results that require logins. Librarians love when you come to them to specifically refine your search. Google still has the most useful search, but they've taken away methods to get bette…

Going backwards and standing still often look the same. I think its both in this case to varying degrees. Google is competing against itself, obvious competitors but also obvious refinements that appear so regardless of actually being implemented. The no-login filter is a refinement that would be useful to many. There are so many obvious improvements that could be made to gmail but there's no real way to do them as a…

Googles priorities have been long shifted from products to money. They are now deliberately doing evil things for more money.

It is like taking small dose of drugs for fun, for sure it won't kill you immediately but it eventually will as people can hardly resist the temptation. Google has been came such a monster, even we know it's dying, but its momentum will keep it going for a very long time. And if it can correct its trajectory just a little bit, the collapsing process will be even longer.

Re: If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

#188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google also keeps a copy of the "entire" web in RAM to search it faster.

Source? But it's definitely possible nowadays when RAM is cheap and modern Google makes the Internet feel incredibly smaller than it was 20 years ago. At the time you would get tons of results from a myriad of small blogs, forums, niche websites. Nowadays it's Pinterest, blogspam and more SEO optimised algorithmic crap. If you're lucky you get a forum result that might actually be relevant. Given the joke that if you…

It looks like I was mistaken. They don't keep all of the documents in RAM, but I'm pretty sure they keep the search index (100 petabytes) in RAM. I'm struggling to find a source but I remember hearing it in a talk given by a Googler on YouTube. I also read somewhere that moving their whole index to RAM is how they brought their response times down from a couple of seconds to a couple hundred milliseconds.

Re: If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

#189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Search, "what hotel to stay in san francisco soma". You'll see that every single result above the fold is an Ad. In fact it doesn't even give me a single useful piece of information. #1 result is a link to expedia. #2 is to hotels.com, #3 to the trip advisor. Scroll down Google Hotels widget. Then on the 3rd browser viewpoint page I get actual query results.

The result I got was a list, with maps and prices with an option to refine stay dates. Not sure how that could be improved to be honest. Next entry was a non-ad from Tripadvisor.

Here's my results: https://ibb.co/cv06gHg https://ibb.co/BwZX9FQ https://ibb.co/NCnBC6b

Re: If Google sucks then why is everyone still using it?

#190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Search, "what hotel to stay in san francisco soma". You'll see that every single result above the fold is an Ad. In fact it doesn't even give me a single useful piece of information. #1 result is a link to expedia. #2 is to hotels.com, #3 to the trip advisor. Scroll down Google Hotels widget. Then on the 3rd browser viewpoint page I get actual query results.

I got a list of hotels. not sure how it could be more useful https://ibb.co/JxfY6BX

Here's my results: https://ibb.co/cv06gHg https://ibb.co/BwZX9FQ https://ibb.co/NCnBC6b
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