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A quick breakdown of what SWIFT is and why it matters

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Re: A quick breakdown of what SWIFT is and why it matters

#181
post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suppose what OP was arguing is, when bank A transfers to bank B, does bank B check with the Feds that the money from bank A is "real"? And is a transfer from A to B really a transfer from A's account at the Feds to B's? In that case, why would the US have to act "indirectly", threatening bank A not to work with bank B? They could simply deny any transfers to and from bank B's account at the Feds, which would make a…

> when bank A transfers to bank B, does bank B check with the Feds that the money from bank A is "real"? Yes, unless the banks have mutual accounts with each other that they can use to settle instead. So, if bank B is accepting to be owed money by bank A for any transfer from A to B, they don't need to settle – but there's practical limits to that, imposed by both risk and regulatory concerns. Eventually, they'll nee…

Thanks for clearing this up for me!

> unless the banks have mutual accounts with each other that they can use to settle instead.

So this is just based on trust that the other bank will keep a truthful score of the transfer, and there won't be a dispute at settlement time?

If the banks are often willing to trade with each other "on trust alone" like that, I suppose that shows why the Feds can't always directly block dollar transfers, but have to rely on threats of account freezes.

Re: A quick breakdown of what SWIFT is and why it matters

#182
post #54
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was watching a mainstream news report (I'll try to find it and edit my comment) where the host and the guest were talking about the impact of economic sanctions. They said it's not intended to stop Russia, but to inflict pain on the citizens, so that they citizens will turn against leadership. In that moment, it really clicked for me how much normal people are pawns to be used in much larger games. And there appare…

With all due respect Russian people are the only ones who can stop Putin.

Ukraine complying with Russia would also stop Putin from attacking Ukraine.

Re: A quick breakdown of what SWIFT is and why it matters

#183
post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sanctions are theatre and will be lifted in a year or so. If the West really cared Swift would have happened long ago. The reality is they do not care for Ukraine.

> The reality is they do not care for Ukraine. I've been thinking about this all day and feel incredibly upset when I see what's going on. What can we do? Have you seen what the Russians did to Grozny? It all boils down to the fact that EU simply can't start a war with a maniac that has thousands of nukes. I'd say let him have it and Ukrainians refugees are welcome here by the millions. Putin's now threatening Finlan…

> Putin's now threatening Finland and Sweden should they dare join NATO

do you have a link i can read up on? I would imagine everyone is running to the safety of NATO now and i can totally see Putin saying "if you try then you're next".

> ...then it's basically WW3. If that's what it takes to get rid of this maniac then so be it but the consequences for everyone will be severe.

"severe" would be the mildest term possible to describe what would happen heh

Re: A quick breakdown of what SWIFT is and why it matters

#184
post #44

quite a few commenters have pointed out SWIFT as a hand of soft power and i think its important to understand the twitter post doesnt mention an important fact: SWIFT was created in order that Europe may resist Kissingers increasingly capricious hand of soft power as it emerged as a lead sap in an increasingly arbitrary US foreign policy. 40 years ago the US had become effectively drunk on soft-power moves against st…

I think anyone with knowledge of how badly Iran has been hit by sanctions would understand that they have a very punitive effect.

Re: A quick breakdown of what SWIFT is and why it matters

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in 2022 sanctions are ... effectively meaningless as most capable, observant countries have managed to sidestep in part or in whole the once dominant US hegemony This is only true to the extent that the US unilaterally imposes sanctions. The proposed sanctions involving SWIFT are multilateral, with the support of the entire EU. That's around double the economic power of the US alone, and roughly half of the entire…

this is an excellent point, one i hadnt considered. SPFS only has 23 banks connected to it as of 2020, so if its to be an alternative Russia would have to consider it as an alterative of last resort. just how strong is it? the consternation im still faced with is "with the support of the entire EU." It may be difficult to secure a resounding vote with the bemoaned sword of Damocles. much heating fuel comes from Russi…

[deleted]

Re: A quick breakdown of what SWIFT is and why it matters

#187
post #5

bitcoin is going to be tricky. unless most miners are in russia they can be convinced to fork chains

Tell me you don't know how bitcoin works without telling me you don't know how bitcoin works.

Sir, this is a HN. Reddit is in the next tab. ;)

Re: A quick breakdown of what SWIFT is and why it matters

#188
post #26

I often wonder how money is stored. It can't be just a number on a computer in a bank, right? Otherwise some Russian bank could just increase that number to whatever they like. And say "Look, we own 100 Trillion USD. Now let's go shopping.". So I guess USD needs to be recognized by the US somehow? Could the US simply "void" all USD that are owned by Russia?

> It can't be just a number on a computer in a bank, right?

And yet people question the utility of a decentralized, trustless, public ledger -- ie. blockchain.

Re: A quick breakdown of what SWIFT is and why it matters

#189

If you are pro SWIFT exclusion of Russia, please like this tweet (or a similar one). https://twitter.com/IchBin_RO/status/1497274721418760193

How will Germany pay for Russian oil if they cannot use SWIFT anymore? I know! Our politicians will simply use whatever financial system that Russia will propose. It would be even possible to trade a fleet of AMGs for a week of oil if need be. Removing SWIFT would only delay trade between Russia and Germany not hinder it in anyway. In fact bartering system would produce more efficiencies, a bullet proof AMG G-wagon f…

Germany wouldn’t pay for gas and oil, and deliveries would stop. Reserves are probably high enough to last into spring, so there’d be about 9 months to find alternatives before next winter.

Russia, meanwhile, would be bankrupt within a few months.

Re: A quick breakdown of what SWIFT is and why it matters

#190

If you are pro SWIFT exclusion of Russia, please like this tweet (or a similar one). https://twitter.com/IchBin_RO/status/1497274721418760193

What good will liking a tweet do? If you are pro-SWIFT-exclusion-of-Russia and live in Germany please contact your national representatives and let them know you're willing to bear some hardship so others don't have to.

Thanks I had quite a laugh reading your last sentence because most peers here in Berlin couldn't be bothered to report anything that doesn't directly impact them.

For people living somewhere out rural shthole in West Germany perhaps might be triggered enough to file a report with the myriad of administrative concerns available to the spoiled citizen

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