The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019) • Hacker News Board

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019)

#181

Post by dang » Thu, Feb 17, 2022, 7:47 PM UTC

sveno wrote: post #162

dang wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I spent a few hours a while back writing up a reusable answer for this question, with lots of links from years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17014869 . The short answer is that not much has changed, including the perceptions of change (e.g. "HN is becoming 2005 Slashdot" - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6157485 - August 2013.) If anyone wants to understand our thinking about political topics on HN,…

Hacker News's biggest problem is the chilling effect. The long-timers know that if you write too well and people start inquiring about a "follow" feature with you in mind, it's only a matter of time before you get banned because you're "too young" (well, he isn't anymore) to have that kind of "success" and less articulate people feel bad about themselves. On politics, Hacker News itself isn't right-wing, at least mos…

I'm finding this a little hard to follow but I'd love to see an example of anyone we banned for writing well or being "too young".

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019)

#182

Post by loceng » Thu, Feb 17, 2022, 7:50 PM UTC

axiomsEnd wrote: post #41

loceng wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think "political" content being so heavily suppressed is the community abdicating responsibility; and also is a sign of how much users here aren't able to emotionally regulate to have civil conversation [which is a signal of strength, of health - physical and mental health, mastery of oneself, self-control] - so much practically everything important - including the Emergency Act (war measures act aka martial law) b…

Or it may that this community is international, so you either have tech talks, or a pile of discussions about politics in every part of the world.

Not really, there's still the rule of "new phenomenon" that makes it news/discussion worthy - like Canada's quick turn towards fascism, tyranny.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019)

#183

Post by bckr » Thu, Feb 17, 2022, 7:51 PM UTC

This nearly brought me to tears. dang and Scott's story was really moving. The humanistic approach, the amount of work to make this website so good. Falling off a mountain and realizing you need a job & need to give up on your startup... novel-worthy stuff.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019)

#184

Post by loceng » Thu, Feb 17, 2022, 7:53 PM UTC

optimalsolver wrote: post #62

loceng wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think "political" content being so heavily suppressed is the community abdicating responsibility; and also is a sign of how much users here aren't able to emotionally regulate to have civil conversation [which is a signal of strength, of health - physical and mental health, mastery of oneself, self-control] - so much practically everything important - including the Emergency Act (war measures act aka martial law) b…

I've never seen an online community improved by more object-level political discussion.

Maybe this avoidance by problem solving engineers is part of the problem?

Technology is used as political tools/weapons to drive and manufacture consent, through promoting hate and creating divisiveness - and through captured mainstream media channels, and online platforms; this couldn't be any more obvious with Trudeau's behaviours and observing the mainstream landscape of what the majority of Canadians are seeing.

Politics and technology is intertwined, but HN is happy to suppress conversation that would arguably lead to discussing technological solutions.

The biggest problem is our information distribution/propagation (and therefore trust) apparatus is corrupted, which does include the issue with low-to-no-effort downvotes allowing a person to suppress content while getting rewarded via a dopamine hit.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019)

#185

Post by foldr » Thu, Feb 17, 2022, 7:53 PM UTC

One thing that puzzles me is why HN does not have a policy of banning users who post explicitly racist comments. I sometimes (unwisely) get sucked into arguing with these people. However, this is essentially impossible to do within the site guidelines, as you either have to have a respectful discussion with a racist (which only legitimizes them) or call them out for being a racist (which isn't allowed). I'm aware that racist comments often get flagged, but then again, they also often don't. And users who post such comments are able to continue contributing to the site.

I won't post links to examples here because, again, that is probably not within the site guidelines. But I'm happy to supply on request.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019)

#186

Post by awb » Thu, Feb 17, 2022, 7:56 PM UTC

jason-phillips wrote: post #178

sveno wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You only have 258 karma. You don't have to worry yet. When you get into the mid-thousands, that's when things get dicey. Tech is like card counting. If you actually figure the game out, you get punished and flushed out. If you keep gambling and losing and don't know why (because you're bad at what you're trying to do) there will be a seat at the table until everything is squeezed out of you.

> Tech is like card counting. If you actually figure the game out, you get punished and flushed out. Wouldn't this dynamic that you describe from your perspective exist in every industry?

Assuming there’s a “game” to be played, and you get pushed out, you probably didn’t understand the real game.

In the card counting example, the game isn’t blackjack, the game is the house always wins. If you’re card counting and losing money, no one cares.

I’ve been reasonably successful in tech and don’t know of any games besides the free market.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019)

#187

Post by dctoedt » Thu, Feb 17, 2022, 7:57 PM UTC

awb wrote: post #176

sveno wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You only have 258 karma. You don't have to worry yet. When you get into the mid-thousands, that's when things get dicey. Tech is like card counting. If you actually figure the game out, you get punished and flushed out. If you keep gambling and losing and don't know why (because you're bad at what you're trying to do) there will be a seat at the table until everything is squeezed out of you.

I have ~12k karma and never experienced anything getting dicey. I’ve never been affiliated with YC or the mods. In my experience it’s a pretty fair community and I’ve been downvoted many times.

Ditto what 'awb said, every word.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019)

#188

Post by exolymph » Thu, Feb 17, 2022, 8:07 PM UTC

lgregg wrote: post #129

dang wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I spent a few hours a while back writing up a reusable answer for this question, with lots of links from years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17014869 . The short answer is that not much has changed, including the perceptions of change (e.g. "HN is becoming 2005 Slashdot" - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6157485 - August 2013.) If anyone wants to understand our thinking about political topics on HN,…

how do you manage all these replies? is it just bookmarked or do you keep a spreadsheet? I see you do this often.

I can call up specific tweets from years ago by searching keywords that I remember (or at least I used to be able to before Twitter nerfed search). Just sticks in the brain.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019)

#189

Post by stronglikedan » Thu, Feb 17, 2022, 8:10 PM UTC

sveno wrote: post #164

0x4d464d48 wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"...there are far too many corporate shills, the good ones know they have to be careful." Huh. Today I learned I'm not one of the good ones.

You only have 258 karma. You don't have to worry yet. When you get into the mid-thousands, that's when things get dicey. Tech is like card counting. If you actually figure the game out, you get punished and flushed out. If you keep gambling and losing and don't know why (because you're bad at what you're trying to do) there will be a seat at the table until everything is squeezed out of you.

> You only have 258 karma.

And you only have 1 karma, so you're not qualified to say what you said in your previous post. Of course, my point is that I know how much karma you have, as much as you know how much karma any other person has, which is...you don't. And I've been here long enough to know that your original comment is getting downvoted, because it's largely full of false statements. Sure, you can cherry pick a few examples here and there, as you could on any site, but to say that is is HN's "biggest problem" is demonstrably false.

Re: The Lonely Work of Moderating Hacker News (2019)

#190

Post by krapp » Thu, Feb 17, 2022, 8:15 PM UTC

loceng wrote: post #182

axiomsEnd wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or it may that this community is international, so you either have tech talks, or a pile of discussions about politics in every part of the world.

Not really, there's still the rule of "new phenomenon" that makes it news/discussion worthy - like Canada's quick turn towards fascism, tyranny.

interesting new phenomenon that satisfies intellectual curiosity.

And by interesting - anything good hackers would find interesting.

It's a purposely high bar to filter out almost all mainstream news and even most tech news, and definitely most politics, which tends to satisfy emotional curiosity at the expense of intellect.

Unfortunately, it doesn't always work. These stories tend to brute-force their way in.