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1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

developer.1password.com

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Re: 1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

#181

Post by roustem »

valenaut wrote: post #131
aniforprez wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I seriously don't understand making blanket statements like this All this fearmongering made me properly look at and note the memory usage of the native windows app and then the electron app after I upgraded. The new app uses a whopping 50MB more when the desktop app is open and uses 10MB less when it's not People keep ranting and raving about this with no context and zero research. I'm sick of this especially on HN

I don't have strong feelings about Electron, but 50MB more memory for the same functionality does seem like a lot. If every app I have open on my machine suddenly used 50MB more memory, it would be a noticeable hit.

But it is not the same functionality at all. In terms of privacy and security, the older versions do not come close. And we reworked many pain points in 1Password 7 — better lock screen, improved sidebar, new watchtower, item editing, (in)security questions, fully encrypted item icons, item location bar, tag autocompletion, special handling of the scenario where 1Password becomes locked in the middle of the editing session — and I am not even listing 10% of all the improvements here.

Re: 1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

#182

Post by jeromegv »

TameAntelope wrote: post #115
otterley wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Memory is a precious resource. Every additional Electron app that’s running increases the likelihood that your system will have to swap, and then it will feel like a a turtle in a tarpit. Also, there’s some concern that continuous swapping prematurely ages SSDs, reducing the overall lifetime of laptops. The modern trend is to solder storage chips directly to the main board, making them difficult to replace.

Memory is not a precious resource, this narrative needs to die an unceremonious death. This isn't the 90s, we live in the future.

Anyone with a system that is running full of Electron apps knows how awful it adds up and how slow they are. Sure just 1 app makes hardly a difference. But I have 16GB of RAM and it gets awfully slow very fast with all that electron mess.

Re: 1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

#183

Post by judge2020 »

minitoar wrote: post #168
terabytest wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you share a little bit about what you'd want to use this for? (I'm part of the 1Password design team)

He already said. Private keys, certs, etc.

Same for things like recovery codes / recovery phrases, although I'm not sure how highly i'd rate a security posture of keeping a password, a 2fa code generator, and recovery codes all in the same entry in a password manager.

Re: 1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

#184

Post by jeromegv »

skuzzie wrote: post #27
tonyedgecombe wrote: post #3

>Set up the 1Password 8 desktop app That will be the Electron version. No thanks.

From the article: "Our new 1Password apps are built in Rust..." Maybe give this version a try then?

This was a PR move to counter the criticism by trying to avoid mentioning Electron, they were heavily criticized for that.

Re: 1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

#185

Post by trvr »

roustem wrote: post #175
Y-bar wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From my own experience with Electron apps and 1Password beta a few months ago, putting resource usage aside (even if we should not): OS-native spell checking is missing. Lack of OS standard shortcuts. Everything is a single window. UX performance: lots of things has just a little bit longer.

We added spellcheck and text transformations options recently. Our team contributed a few patches to Electron to enable better macOS integration. For example: https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/32024 I believe the UX performance in 1Password 8 is better than any other app we built in the past: https://twitter.com/mitchchn/status/1491253916004147203?s=20 Would love to learn more about the standard shortcuts tha…

Not looking for a fight here, but it seems like there is a disconnect between 1Password/AgileBits praising version 8 while also trying to bury the fact that it is an Electron app. It seems like you are proud of what you are building (and that's awesome), but the Releases page for beta [1] doesn't contain the word Electron.

1: https://releases.1password.com/mac/beta/

Re: 1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

#186

Post by DonHopkins »

terabytest wrote: post #167
DonHopkins wrote: post #139

A huge problematic deficiency of 1Password is that it lacks literal multi-line text field types. The items in its database let you define custom fields for them, but there is no literal multi line text field. There's a "File" type, but you can't simply define fields with multi-line text values. However, every item has exactly one built-in "notes" field, but that's actually styled markdown text. And you only get one.…

Could you share a little bit about what you'd want to use this for? (I'm part of the 1Password design team)

SSH keys have both a private and a public file. The private file is multi-line text.

I don't like putting the private key in the notes field, because its name is still "notes" (but I'd prefer the label be the key's file name), it's actually markdown formatted text, not literal text, and what if I still want to write a note, but I've already used the notes field for the key?

HTTPS certificates including multiple certificate chains, and private keys, and those are all multi line files. And each part should go into a separate clearly labeled multi line field. And I don't want to be forced to write a copy of my server's ssh key into a local file on my laptop in order to attach it to a 1Password file field, and remember to delete it quickly before Time Machine backs it up for posterity.

Right now I am forced to concatenate all my certificates and keys into the "notes" field, and write the file name before each part, and put blank lines between each file, which is terribly inconvenient and error prone.

I also put a multi-line list of all the user names and passwords that I set up on a server.

There are millions of other reasons why anyone might want to use a multi line text field beyond ssh keys and certificates, just use your imagination.

My question is why wasn't this obvious feature supported from day 1, like I fully expected it to be with I bought a 1Password license? Why did I have to find that out for myself the hard and disappointing way, because I never noticed a section in the 1Password manual or promotional advertisements about why 1Password made the decision not to support multi line text fields. I'd love to know the reasoning behind that decision.

[Edit in response to "Maybe I don’t understand, but couldn’t you use the notes section? Wrap whatever you need in triple backticks to create a code block?":]

I PAYED for 1Password, and the company I work for standardized on it and requires we use it, so I kind of expect not to have to jump through those kinds of pointless hoops with a commercial product. I should be able to select-all/copy/paste without meticulously selecting just the right text character-by-character. The time I waste doing just that would pay for a yearly subscription to a better product.

Re: 1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

#187

Post by [deleted] »

trvr wrote: post #28
snide wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get the hate on Electron. Is it often bloated? Yes, sure. Has it allowed some of these excellent third party apps to make the move to Linux? Absolutely. I've been utterly surprised and excited by how much better 1Password has gotten over the last two years on Linux. We're seeing real parity with the OSX side of the house. Would I love native apps? Again, sure. But I really don't care. It runs pretty fast on m…

I think a lot of the hate (myself included) is coming from the fact that we already had a really good native macOS app. Feels like something is being taken away. I do understand where you are coming from with Linux. It's better than what you had, no doubt. But that doesn't feel like the case to us macOS users.

[deleted]

Re: 1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

#188

Post by oldandboring »

MrYellowP wrote: post #57

I still have no idea why people use these kinds of programs. I have no idea how companies managed to sell this security nightmare as a feature to actually serious people. A single point of failure. Yeah, great idea!

Information security is nearly always about trade-offs and this is no exception.

What you give:

- a single point of failure (one complex password you memorize that locally unlocks a DB of credentials that is stored encrypted in the cloud).

What you get:

- all passwords are unique and complex (assuming you use a password generator, which all these tools have built-in)

- the convenience of having all your passwords ready for use on any of your devices

- the convenience of auto-fill

- the convenience of being able to share logins e.g. a spouse or across your organization.

- the convenience of being able to also store, share, and auto-fill secrets besides logins (identities, credit cards, free-text notes).

Been using a password manager for 15+ years and I have never suffered fallout from the single-point of failure tradeoff, only benefits from the power and convenience I got as a result.

Re: 1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

#189

Post by Karunamon »

TameAntelope wrote: post #115
otterley wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Memory is a precious resource. Every additional Electron app that’s running increases the likelihood that your system will have to swap, and then it will feel like a a turtle in a tarpit. Also, there’s some concern that continuous swapping prematurely ages SSDs, reducing the overall lifetime of laptops. The modern trend is to solder storage chips directly to the main board, making them difficult to replace.

Memory is not a precious resource, this narrative needs to die an unceremonious death. This isn't the 90s, we live in the future.

As someone who has to occasionally unstick stuck systems by way of `echo 3 > /proc/sys/vm/drop_caches` because memory management in the real world doesn't work the way the people who write condescending sites like linuxatemyram.com say it does:

Memory most definitely is a previous resource.

Re: 1Password for SSH and Git (Beta)

#190

Post by judge2020 »

trvr wrote: post #185
roustem wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We added spellcheck and text transformations options recently. Our team contributed a few patches to Electron to enable better macOS integration. For example: https://github.com/electron/electron/pull/32024 I believe the UX performance in 1Password 8 is better than any other app we built in the past: https://twitter.com/mitchchn/status/1491253916004147203?s=20 Would love to learn more about the standard shortcuts tha…

Not looking for a fight here, but it seems like there is a disconnect between 1Password/AgileBits praising version 8 while also trying to bury the fact that it is an Electron app. It seems like you are proud of what you are building (and that's awesome), but the Releases page for beta [1] doesn't contain the word Electron. 1: https://releases.1password.com/mac/beta/

Electron is effectively a UI and code framework, much like SwiftUI or just Swift with AppKit; I don't see why either would need to be a marketing point or referenced in the changelog. 1Password 7[0] doesn't say what it's made in either.

0: https://support.1password.com/explore/whats-new-mac/

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