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$130B wiped off crypto markets in 24 hours

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Re: $130B wiped off crypto markets in 24 hours

#181

Post by asimpletune »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #146
skrebbel wrote: post #19

I own no crypto and I think it's a ridiculous piece of hype, but I think all that reporting (and, on twitter, all that schadenfreude) about bitcoin (etc) going down is nonsense. If you look at a 5 year chart of the BTC value, it's still super insane high and it's been going down hard once before (summer 2021). If I were a crypto fan I'd just tweet HODL like every previous time.

The thing about Bitcoin specifically, though, is that there are only really 2 possible outcomes: 1. The world decides it's "tulips" at some point, and the value goes to 0. 2. The world decides it will be a major part of the financial system, and it goes to 500k or 1 million. Basically, anything in between is just a probability calculation of whether it will end up at one end or the other. The problem with this, thoug…

I could be wrong about this, but I don't know if the energy requirements have anything to do with the price (I.e. demand) for the coin, does it? I was under the impression that the problems that you have to solve get predictably more difficult, and they're more of a function of time than price.

But yes, with your point overall I agree, like in 10 years or something it doesn't seem workable without major changes. Wasn't that what lightening or side chains were supposed to do?

Any way, also, I don't own any crypto and I'm definitely not defending it. Feel free to correct me too if I'm mistaken, anyone.

Re: $130B wiped off crypto markets in 24 hours

#182

Post by rocgf »

elif wrote: post #137
streamofdigits wrote: post #116

There is no much point in arguing with a cult. This phenomenon will have to work its way through the susceptible demographic, meaning that the large majority of "speculators" will have transferred their disposable wealth to a minority of shrewd operators. The masses will subsequently be "seasoned", or immunized and will no longer participate, at best disappointed, disgusted and mildly embarrassed, at worst suffering…

better than the cult of USD. how's that doing this year? or last year? or the year before? or ever? does it even have a THEORETICAL path to value? I'll take my currently existing and computationally reinforced and yes bubbly increase of value.

What do you mean a "theoretical path to value"?

If I understand you correctly, I think you're implying that everything has to be speculative, like currencies too?

Re: $130B wiped off crypto markets in 24 hours

#184

Post by ipnon »

mountainriver wrote: post #23
Dma54rhs wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the markets are down to be honest and these swings are so common in crypto that while it makes a good headline its nothing new.

Because crypto is a stable asset to put your money into

The one qualm I have with this line of thinking is that: 1) Buying crypto is optional, and 2) It is a mainstream view now that crypto is extremely volatile, a risky investment, and yes, even a "ponzi scheme".

Given all this, and assuming adults are free to accept their own risk tolerance, what is the problem? If these are the assumptions, there is none. The problem comes from the belief that there is some limit to acceptable risk tolerance for the general public, beyond which it is so risky as to be definitely detrimental to the public's finances.

I claim that there are many riskier stocks already than the mainstream crypto. Outright fraudulent crypto are also already illegal under current securities law. Is it really just the concept of a tokenized, distributed public ledger (re: blockchain) that rubs people the wrong way?

Re: $130B wiped off crypto markets in 24 hours

#185

Post by mdavis6890 »

melenaboija wrote: post #108
kasey_junk wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Modern treasury operations for large cash holders absolutely “invest” in currencies. They do so in the form of what cash they hold outside of their immediate needs and in what cash “equivalents” they keep on their books.

What’s the difference between “investing” and investing? Maybe that will help me to better understand cryptocurrencies “investors”.

Investing is when you buy something that creates enduring, repeated value over an indefinite period of time, which you can capture without selling the asset itself. Real estate, for example, creates value (a place to live) over a long time, which you can capture either by living there yourself or renting it to someone else - without selling the house.

Stock is ownership in a business which creates value over time (shoes, tweets, cars, etc) which is captured in a variety of ways, like selling through retail or ads or whatever - without selling the stock.

This is why currencies, gold and the like are not investments. They do not, in and of themselves, create value. They may be good to buy/hold anyway though!

Re: $130B wiped off crypto markets in 24 hours

#186

Post by lilSebastian »

mitchdoogle wrote: post #67
lilSebastian wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Everything is on sale. Such meaningless phrasing. If something wasn't on sale, nobody could buy it. The crypto meme of dips in the price being 'a sale' is key to hooking the uniformed new fish into the great ponzi scheme.

It's not just crypto buyers with this mindset.. it's been part of stock market investing for a while. Buy low when everyone else is selling

I made no claim that it was a purely crypto mindset, they've flogged this phrase to death, and continue to do so in their echo chamber communities.

Re: $130B wiped off crypto markets in 24 hours

#187

Post by lupire »

tim333 wrote: post #102
podgaj wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin is probably the first Ponzi scheme where everyone in it knows it is a Ponzi scheme. So I agree with your take here.

As an occasional bitcoin holder, I don't think it's a Ponzi scheme. Who's the Ponzi schemer? How come every time it collapses it comes back bigger in a year or two?

only 7Billion suckers on Earth. Pretty soon you'll need aliens to buy BTC to keep propping up the price...

Re: $130B wiped off crypto markets in 24 hours

#188

Post by CryptoPunk »

streamofdigits wrote: post #116

There is no much point in arguing with a cult. This phenomenon will have to work its way through the susceptible demographic, meaning that the large majority of "speculators" will have transferred their disposable wealth to a minority of shrewd operators. The masses will subsequently be "seasoned", or immunized and will no longer participate, at best disappointed, disgusted and mildly embarrassed, at worst suffering…

I have no idea what future crypto prices will do, but you do realize that smart contracts allow people to bank, from their browser with nothing but a MetaMask extension, without a bank, right?

There's heavy dose of speculation present in any emerging market, but crypto, especially its smart contract sector, is not just speculation.

Re: $130B wiped off crypto markets in 24 hours

#189

Post by lupire »

sschueller wrote: post #118
dtech wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies have ~zero inherent value, due to their non-speculation use-cases like payment being very limited or still early development (smart contracts). Unless you count BTC in black market I guess. USD has inherent value, it's the only currency where you can pay taxes in, and if you want to do business with government or government employees - who are ever only paid in USD - you must accept…

But it's not a Ponzi scheme. It's a currency with small adoption like that of a third world nation.

It's not a currency for anyone who is holding it long term, by definition.

Re: $130B wiped off crypto markets in 24 hours

#190

Post by matheusmoreira »

darkwater wrote: post #155
matheusmoreira wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I deposited most of it in a binance savings account. Left some in my mobile wallet. Unfortunately I had to cash it out in order to spend it. Wish I didn't have to but nothing else accepted it. These things will not ever be real if we don't start using them as currencies. I came this close to proposing Monero transactions to a business partner after some banking problems but the market isn't looking good right now, to…

Your "unfortunately" part is the whole point of what GGP was saying.

It's not useless though. It works just fine as a currency. It's just that nobody is using it. Like how Signal is more trustworthy than WhatsApp but nobody I know uses it so it doesn't matter.
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