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Open-Sourcing our Firmware

frame.work

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Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#181

Post by adamweld »

ohazi wrote: post #124

I've been so happy to see what Framework has been doing lately, and really want to support them, but I already have a desktop as my primary computer and two Thinkpads that are already set up nicely, but that I rarely use. I moved from 15" laptops to 14" when Lenovo added the numpad on the larger variant, and 14" is about as small as I want to go. I kind of want to buy a framework though, just to support them? But I h…

Can anyone recommend a laptop that gets great battery life on Linux and has a good keyboard?

I've been thinking about selling my current beefy laptop (razer blade 15) since I end up doing all my MCAD/ECAD work on my desktop anyway, and moving back to Manjaro on my laptop which only really gets used for software/firmware anyway.

But, I read so many horror stories about linux firmware glitchyness and poor battery life that I gave up on the idea. If I can just by a used thinkpad from a few generations ago that might be perfect.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#182

Post by nrp »

ad8e wrote: post #165

I checked the keyboard debouncing logic [0] and it was fine. Some keyboards from other manufacturers, notably Lenovo Thinkpads, have absurd debouncing algorithms that scramble keys or add delays, so it's good to see Framework has a correct solution. [0]: https://github.com/FrameworkComputer/EmbeddedController/blob...

We used the chromium-ec logic as-is (checking git blame), but I believe did tune the debounce timer to match the characteristics of the keyboard itself.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#183

Post by walteweiss »

bbojan wrote: post #130
philipprk wrote: post #35

Really hoping for the laptop's next iteration to have a reverse T for the arrow keys. Otherwise very solid laptop, would be my first non-Mac choice.

Because I'm down the rabbit hole of highly customized keyboards, at one point I did a frequency analysis of the keys I use the most. Guess what was the most frequently used key? Cursor down followed by cursor up. For example, cursor down was pressed ~2.5x more times than space, or ~4 times more than letter E, which is was the most frequently used letter. Guess what are the smallest keys on a Mac-type keyboard (the la…

I am on a Mac for over a decade and I don’t understand what’s the issue with the keys. Well, they are smaller, but it’s not a problem for me, not at all.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#184

Post by franga2000 »

bbojan wrote: post #130
philipprk wrote: post #35

Really hoping for the laptop's next iteration to have a reverse T for the arrow keys. Otherwise very solid laptop, would be my first non-Mac choice.

Because I'm down the rabbit hole of highly customized keyboards, at one point I did a frequency analysis of the keys I use the most. Guess what was the most frequently used key? Cursor down followed by cursor up. For example, cursor down was pressed ~2.5x more times than space, or ~4 times more than letter E, which is was the most frequently used letter. Guess what are the smallest keys on a Mac-type keyboard (the la…

Keep in mind this is likely unique to CLI users. The vast majority of users have little use for arrow keys - nudging the text cursor a few chars left/right and making tiny moves in graphics software are about the only two I can think of.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#185

Post by vorpalhex »

adamweld wrote: post #181
ohazi wrote: post #124

I've been so happy to see what Framework has been doing lately, and really want to support them, but I already have a desktop as my primary computer and two Thinkpads that are already set up nicely, but that I rarely use. I moved from 15" laptops to 14" when Lenovo added the numpad on the larger variant, and 14" is about as small as I want to go. I kind of want to buy a framework though, just to support them? But I h…

Can anyone recommend a laptop that gets great battery life on Linux and has a good keyboard? I've been thinking about selling my current beefy laptop (razer blade 15) since I end up doing all my MCAD/ECAD work on my desktop anyway, and moving back to Manjaro on my laptop which only really gets used for software/firmware anyway. But, I read so many horror stories about linux firmware glitchyness and poor battery life…

I get decent but not amazing battery life on my XPS 15, running Pop_OS. About 5-6 hours of actual use time. No major firmware issues but it is using Nvidia.

XPS 15 laptops appear to have an unresolved mouse lag issue that is noticeable under linux (but seems to happen in Windows too). Seems to not happen with external mice. Annoying but not a big deal. There is an open issue for it but no patch yet.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#186

Post by franga2000 »

varispeed wrote: post #132
tomtheelder wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect majority of users never touch Pg Up/Pg Dn/Home/End and all those other keys over there. For arrow keys, the compacted layout is helpful when designing a space constrained keyboard, and it's totally usable.

Wouldn't that be because these keys are difficult to use in typical laptop keyboard, as in self fulfilling prophecy?

It probably doesn't help, but it definitely isn't the reason. Most people still do their work on desktops with full-sized keyboards and they already don't use those keys there.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#187

Post by raybb »

khimaros wrote: post #150
ohazi wrote: post #124

I've been so happy to see what Framework has been doing lately, and really want to support them, but I already have a desktop as my primary computer and two Thinkpads that are already set up nicely, but that I rarely use. I moved from 15" laptops to 14" when Lenovo added the numpad on the larger variant, and 14" is about as small as I want to go. I kind of want to buy a framework though, just to support them? But I h…

invest in the company financially

It doesn't seem like that's possible right now: https://community.frame.work/t/investing-in-framework/3980/1...

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#188

Post by vorpalhex »

DrBenCarson wrote: post #131
reacharavindh wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I very much wanted to hear about this and damn :-( Video playback must be hardware accelerated by now and be super efficient. Another worry was about low power sleep modes and waking up, and looks like it is not solved too. I might have to suck it up and buy the Mac for my needs after all. I have my trusty Linux desktop for all my big compute needs. I was hoping to make the mobile machine also run Linux, but the spec…

* crisp display * nice battery life * Linux friendliness Not elusive at all, you can find an M1 MacBook Pro at any Apple, Best Buy, or Costco store.

You can't even run unsigned apps on your M1. There is linux support slowly coming thanks to the fine folks on Asahi, but it is very pre-beta.

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#189

Post by bubblethink »

sydney6 wrote: post #168
bestouff wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that current Intel laptops don't use S3 anymore, they use S0ix a.k.a. "modern standby", an abomination where the CPU doesn't really sleep and the battery drains fast. Dell, Lenovo, HP etc. all have the same problem.

I have a Thinkpad X1 from 2018 and by default it came with S0ix enabled and Lenovo later on added the S3 sleep state option through a BIOS update, called "Linux compatibility something".. Before that, one had to manually edit the DSD table to get rid of this evil burning-sleeping-laptop-in-backpack-feature called S0ix. Does the Framework Laptop, or other popular models from the other manfacturers you mentioned, not h…

So it was believed that S3 is deprecated on TGL, but it probably works. I remember reading about it on some coreboot channels. Starlabs may have enabled it. Grep for S3 on https://support.starlabs.systems/kb/bios-and-firmware/bios-a...

Re: Open-Sourcing our Firmware

#190

Post by Ericson2314 »

lillecarl wrote: post #100
_zooted wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having come from elementaryOS I can say that Fedora 35 is awesome. So much better!

Having come from Debian, Ubuntu, and Manjaro I settled on what feels like the last distro I will use on my own systems: NixOS. It's not so much better, it's so much different. Every(ish) single package, every single line of configuration(ish) is under version control in a(couple) nix files. I share (most) of it between my systems. With flakes (and it's lockfile) it's a 100%(ish) deterministic system. Downside: The la…

> I also don't use home-manager, but chezmoi for my dotfiles. Since I want my home configuration to work on MacOS and other distros I might SSH.

FYI, home manager works on MacOS just fine. I usually tell people to start with Home Manager as I think it's the best gateway drug to Nix stuff at the moment.

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