Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022 • Hacker News Board

Re: Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022

#181

Post by jjav » Tue, Dec 21, 2021, 8:03 AM UTC

admax88qqq wrote: post #74

gruez wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>and then you upgrade to a faster unit with next-gen wifi or whatever Do people actually need next-gen wifi? My impression is that 99.9+% of people would be well served by a mid-range 802.11ac router (eg. AC1750[1]) from years ago, because the most bandwidth intensive thing they do is watch 4k netflix (~25 Mb/s). [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.11ac-2013

I'm sure people said the same thing about 802.11ac when everyone was on n, or n when everyone was on g. Faster is always better. New 802.11ax also improves contention between devices.

> Faster is always better.

For wifi faster isn't always better if there's nowhere to go. That is, if the uplink from home isn't itself faster.

Re: Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022

#182

Post by lmns » Tue, Dec 21, 2021, 8:08 AM UTC

gruez wrote: post #94

admax88qqq wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure people said the same thing about 802.11ac when everyone was on n, or n when everyone was on g. Faster is always better. New 802.11ax also improves contention between devices.

>I'm sure people said the same thing about 802.11ac when everyone was on n, or n when everyone was on g. You'd probably be well served by 802.11n right now . Take a typical setup of 802.11n with 2x2 MIMO: theoretical speeds would be 300Mb/s. Halve that for "real world" performance, and you have speeds of 150Mb/s. That's more than enough for multiple streams of 4k netflix. Looking around it looks like most 802.11n ada…

802.11n with 5 GHz is okayish, but using 2.4 GHz can be brutal. It's not just the bandwidth, the whole frequency band is just bad. My latency regularly goes through the roof and voice calls are noticeably worse than with 5 GHz wifi.

802.11ac mandates 5 GHz, so it's a reasonable baseline. I don't even care if it's SISO, MIMO or whatever as long as I don't have to fall back to 2.4 GHz.

Re: Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022

#183

Post by jjav » Tue, Dec 21, 2021, 8:29 AM UTC

judge2020 wrote: post #42

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You won’t be able to update things like Wi-Fi network settings, add additional Wifi devices, or run speed tests." Aren't they reaching into Your device to remove functionality? Isn't this vandalism, and a crime?

It’s not a crime, since the advertising includes OTA as a feature and it’s not criminal to remove functionality from a previously-sold device.

> it’s not criminal to remove functionality from a previously-sold device

I'm sure it's not criminal, given today's laws.

Think about that statement though. It absolutely should, morally, be criminal to take away something that was sold as functioning.

Imagine in the 80s that VCR manufacturers sent people to your home at night to open your VCR and cut some traces so it could play but no longer record. Would be an outrage. Also, fortunately, was in practice impossible.

Just because today devices are built to enable damaging functionality from afar doesn't means it is suddenly ok.

Re: Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022

#184

Post by kohlerm » Tue, Dec 21, 2021, 9:02 AM UTC

bonoboTP wrote: post #88

It's a meme now that Google doesn't support anything long term and breaks compatibility etc. all the time. Why? Because that's what's incentivized for the engineers and managers. You climb the career ladder by releasing new stuff. Supporting old stuff is a dead end careerwise. If that's the culture, this is what you get. On the whole, it does seem to work out well for them!

monorepo culture, everyone needs to use the latest and "greatest"

Re: Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022

#185

Post by londons_explore » Tue, Dec 21, 2021, 9:52 AM UTC

ineedasername wrote: post #95

qmarchi wrote: post #25

In case anyone wants it, here's how to root a TP-Link OnHub. They're essentially glorified chromebooks, with some magic sauce on them. https://www.exploitee.rs/index.php/Rooting_The_Google_OnHub Dis: Googler, not near Nest/Home

Would rooting allow reconfiguration that Google will now be blocking through the Home app?

Yes

Re: Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022

#186

Post by londons_explore » Tue, Dec 21, 2021, 9:56 AM UTC

drivebycomment wrote: post #149

If anyone working on Onhub is reading this, can you please at least implement a json http api on the local network side that allows configuring the basic settings like WAN settings, DNS settings, network name and password, etc, so that the router can be kept functional for minimal case ? I don't care if you stop producing the app - but if you can implement a basic json api, I think community can easily keep it workin…

I think it has such an API already. Just nobody has figured out the Auth for it. Probably a few days decompiling the API server would figure it out though.

There is a neighbouring diagnostic info endpoint that doesn't require Auth, and that works fine.

Re: Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022

#187

Post by Arcanum-XIII » Tue, Dec 21, 2021, 10:09 AM UTC

jkelleyrtp wrote: post #119

worik wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is five years enough? For you maybe. I think it is nothing like enough. My guitar amplifier is about twenty years old. My house is thirty and will probably make it to 300 (climate catastrophes wiling) I do not buy Google products, if I did I would stop.

Well, electric guitars have been around for over 80 years and houses even longer. This whole wireless internet thing is pretty recent and is getting increasingly better every year.

I have some power tool from the 60, with a deviation of precision about a 1/100mm from manufacturing time, while abused in factory. Heck, I just got a new drill from 1959, with the same. They were also “recent” design at the time…

Re: Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022

#188

Post by ClumsyPilot » Tue, Dec 21, 2021, 10:35 AM UTC

reaperducer wrote: post #132

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"It’s not a crime, since the advertising includes OTA as a feature" My car includes free service as a feature, that doesn't mean they can take off the wheels while I sleep and call it 'service'. Similarly I don't think any reasonable person or judge will agree bricking a device is called 'update'.

Similarly I don't think any reasonable person or judge will agree bricking a device is called 'update'. I had a bunch of IoT lightbulbs intentionally bricked by the manufacturer. I can't remember the name of the company now. Something beginning with "F," and ending with "Electric," I think. This was back in the days before HomeKit, when IoT was even more Wild West than it is today. I had about a dozen of the light bu…

That atrocious. Either this is vandalism, or we have no rights to private property any more

Re: Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022

#189

Post by Ekaros » Tue, Dec 21, 2021, 10:40 AM UTC

jjav wrote: post #178

whatever1 wrote: post #67

Btw Onhub does not even have a browser accessible interface like every router has. The only way to manage it is through the app (that they will decommission). Reviewers and experts called this out at the time, but Google reassured that onhub will not face any issues since they will commit to long term support of the device. As a testament to that they highlighted the overspecification of the device (it had enormous r…

Phone apps (and the mobile OSs they run on) have a very limited support lifetime. What phone apps from even a decade ago still run if unmaintained? Or are even available? No non-disposable hardware should ever depend on a phone app, lest it become equally disposable. All my electronics and computers from the 80s and 90s run just fine today! In great part because they don't depend on anything. Electronics from the 202…

Reminds me of sous vide and Joule compared to competitors. Ofc, sleek nice clean small design is nice. But only to be able to use with app... Just no. I can get those features and physical controls as well. Albeit touch screen which responses to water drops on machine usually dealing with some amount of condensation near it...

Yeah, I won't touch anything that doesn't have basic controls as physical.

Re: Google to end support for OnHub routers in 2022

#190

Post by tinus_hn » Tue, Dec 21, 2021, 11:28 AM UTC

slenk wrote: post #164

robocat wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Make sure you check out some of the other "pro-sumer" lines first Unless you enjoy networking as a hobby, I would worry with that strategy that there is a sizeable risk of wasting your time with unreliable devices, with ongoing maintenance work, or having to rework your network in a few years. My current solution is to buy Unifi UAP-AC-LR (~120USD) and configure it as an access point using the “Unifi Network” app f…

That works great if you can run PoE everywhere. Do they have a unifi version that I can plug in to a wall outlet without having to upgrade everything to PoE too? Unless you have PoE you can't add a unifi AP for $120 USD. And getting into PoE isn't cheap.

You don’t need to ‘run’ PoE everywhere, it just provides power over the cables you are already using.