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Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

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Re: Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

#181
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'stop adding value'? WTF.

Genuinely curious: Why is your reaction to that "WTF"? I think it's totally valid.

Well, for one thing, "adds value" on HN is a pretty loaded term that comes down to "making money for someone else". You're basically saying that when you can't pull any harder, you'll line up behind Boxer at the glue factory so the pigs get one last cent out of your hide.

But lets assume a more charitable definition of 'adds value', then when does that end? I'd argue 'never', but I've also lost a parent and an in-law this year, so maybe that's still a little close for me.

Re: Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

#182
I'm sorry this isn't much use to the parent poster, but I think these conversations really need to happen years if not decades before it's time for the change. 70-somethings can be lively and wonderful, but as a generalization they are going to be very set in their ways and extremely loathe to changing their valued routines. At their age, even something simple like getting acquainted with new neighbors (and losing decades-long connections with old neighbors) can be really intimidating. They can have emotional attachments to rooms of their house that they probably can't even verbalize.

Re: Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

#183
I don't have specific advice for the original question. But I have been exceedingly happy with what my own parents have done, they're both in their early 70s.

During the last 10 years, all 4 of my grandparents have passed away. They lived long good lives, and did my parents the service of "taking turns". Though one had 3 kids and the other 6, it fell to my parents to do the majority of the work during each's final years due to many issues, geography being one. It was a LOT of work for my parents. Many times they joked that, just when they got the kids out of the house and on their own, it was time to start taking care of grandma and grandpa.

Having been through that, my parents have taken some steps to avoid some of the pitfalls they experienced. Once a year, we have a family dinner (us and their children + spouses). It's usually a sort of joint anniversary dinner. And after dinner, we have a "state of the union" type chat. At least an hour or more. Our parents talk about how they're doing, how their finances are doing, how their health is doing, even their mental health, what's bumming that out, etc. We ask questions. It's all very candid.

This discussion is never had without everyone present. My Mom's explanation is that she doesn't want there to be any sort of "well, when I was talking to Mom she said, and what I think she'd want is..." There won't be arguments about when or if to put them in a nursing home. We know how they want to be buried. Kind of service, etc.

There will, I'm sure, be surprises and we'll have to adapt. But we've tried, and it's a together effort, because they kicked the ball off that way. Before it was too late to have these discussions. Their biggest frustration with their own parents had been that they didn't want to talk about it, and when it came time to have to talk about it, it was too late. People's faculties and emotions were compromised at that point.

My wife and I have compared this to her parents who are in their late 80's. It's going to be a mess. They won't talk about it. Don't want to. It's uncomfortable. And the kids all have their own viewpoints on thing.

If you can, before it's too late, start having the candid discussions now, together as a group. It makes things way better in dealing with the downhill years.

Re: Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One major thing you have to worry about with octogenarians is falls. There are all sorts of injuries related to falls but the worst one is to break a hip. It can happen very easily. When old folks break a hip, it sets off a chain of consequences that are really, really bad for their health and quality of life. To begin with, it immediately requires hospitalization and major surgery. Then, a period of immobilization s…

that is all true, i've seen two ideas : - western way: use tech. some people have floor detectors, doesn't avoid the fall but helps saving people early. Maybe soft floors help too - easter way: daily taichi .. so then you just roll and never fall

My grandmother who lived to her mid 90s did a lot of arm exercises to get the blood circulation going. She would stand up and just fling her arms up and down.

Saw this earlier this year (it's a body airbag for old people in case they fall. Invented by a Chinese so eastern way haha), reminds me of the bike helmet some Swedes demonstrated a few years back

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9W6wNfzsIE

Re: Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

#185
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'stop adding value'? WTF.

Outside of HN that would probably be phrased as 'become a burden on my family'.

So my father-in-law passed away from dementia recently so I've been thinking about this a lot. Some family members could not be arsed (to borrow a phrase) to really care for him over the last several years, and from their viewpoint he was a burden. Some could, though, and to them he wasn't a burden, but a way to express their love. And looking back his long decline of course had a negative effect on a lot of people, but I don't know if it would have been any less negative had he put a bullet in his brain 5 years ago.

Re: Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

that is all true, i've seen two ideas : - western way: use tech. some people have floor detectors, doesn't avoid the fall but helps saving people early. Maybe soft floors help too - easter way: daily taichi .. so then you just roll and never fall

My grandmother who lived to her mid 90s did a lot of arm exercises to get the blood circulation going. She would stand up and just fling her arms up and down. Saw this earlier this year (it's a body airbag for old people in case they fall. Invented by a Chinese so eastern way haha), reminds me of the bike helmet some Swedes demonstrated a few years back https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9W6wNfzsIE

honestly it's pretty awesome to see this prototyped.. i dont know how it will be received and sold but it's super useful

I also thought we should have cushioned sports area for 60+

places you can just try shit and never fear shocks

Re: Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

#187
Parents are a bit younger (late 60s), but the biggest thing I keep watch for is their mobility and anything that affects it. My relatives that passed away all had one great correlation in their decline -- the loss of mobility, which really caused everything else to spiral out of control.

Body movement affects a lot of how the entire system works, and also gives them a lot more options to the outside world. Make exercise as fun and frictionless as possible. My parents joined an all-ages ping pong club, a gardening club, and a hiking group... so it covers both physical upkeep to an extent + social/mental one.

Re: Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

#188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, a fall also was the beginning of the end for my uncle. My mom also had a (non-hip-related) fall and that resulted in a hospital and nursing home stay (fortunately she seems to have recovered for the most part). I read this illustrated aging-parent-focused autobiography lately https://www.theguardian.com/books/2014/jul/13/cant-we-talk-a... (by Roz Chast, a New Yorker cartoonist) and it was very much about these i…

There are auto-inflating airbag belts that protect the hips for seniors during falls. I think the tech started in motorcycle racing then became available for cyclists, and is finally available for seniors now. Here's one company I found but I think there are others offering solutions too: https://en.helite.com/hipguard/

This looks like an interesting product but how do you get them to wear it consistently? Half the problem in hip fractures is mentation: Many elderly people have decreased balance, decreased pain sense, and decreased muscle strength. And yet they're not cognizant of any of this, so they continue to try to behave the way they did 20 years ago and of course they fall. Getting them to become aware of their limitations would prevent a lot of falls but it is very difficult. I'd expect that getting them to wear this belt would be similarly difficult.

Re: Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

#189
post #73

I'm a realist. I told my parents (one retired but active and one preparing to retire) that they needed to get their end of life plans and elder care plans in place because I wasn't going to do it for them. My wife and I don't have children and are hoping to spend our retirement being semi-mobile around the globe. We simply won't be available to take care of them in their old age. I threatened (only half joking) that…

I bet you're glad that they didn't view you as much of an inconvenience to their life ambitions as you view them.

Having a kid is a choice they made. You don't choose to be born.

Re: Ask HN: Advice about aging parents

#190

Macabre tangent warning. Related to this, and having seen several cases where elderly people had very unhappy end years for various reasons (dementia, incapacity, etc.) I am starting to wonder not for our parents bur for myself - how could I make sure I don't live past the point where I stop adding value and become a drain. It's an interesting engineering problem. Presumably this would be when I lose mental capacity…

Assisted suicide is becoming more accepted as an option for the elderly. I suspect that some day it will be as normal our current options for extending life. I for one would rather die on my own time, surrounded by family when my quality of life declines, rather than clinging on to a miserable existence.

One unfortunate aspect of this that while some jurisdictions have this available, they are sticky with informed consent on day of.

As a result people will sometimes opt for this months, even years before they really needed to, because of the fear of dementia or similar taking the choice away.

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