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Why Monero

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Re: Why Monero

#181

Post by R0b0t1 »

sdze wrote: post #178

GNU Taler is (for Europeans at least) the most promising system, because it is controllable (at least on the merchant side). The users themself are anonymous, just like when using cash! That is a good system because it enables governments to still being able to tax businesses and control illegal activities. Such system will also gain more acceptance among the common folks. https://taler.net/en/index.html

The most promising? What do you mean? BTC and XMR already work and don't have the downsides of Taler. Usability could be improved for those, yes.

Outside transparency is not a benefit. Most people I've talked to about crypto don't see the opacity as a detriment. They do not trust the government or tax policy. Most of these people are also generally happy to pay their taxes but can see reasons when they would want to hide their behavior.

Re: Why Monero

#182

Post by faeyanpiraat »

Mistletoe wrote: post #163
stavros wrote: post #2

I'm not really happy promoting a cryptocurrency these days, given that most of them are get-rich-quick schemes, but Monero has been solid for the past 5-6 years that I've been using it. It's completely anonymous, sends quickly, has minimal fees, and it hasn't been as full of cultists as some of the other coins I've seen. I use it to pay for some things and it's always a pleasant experience. I recommend it. The only d…

Monero is one of the truly useful coins and perversely one of the worst performing coins price-wise. There is a horrible lesson in there somewhere about hype and endless promises and markets. https://cryptorank.io/performance

Isn’t a stable price a good thing?

If I had a dollar that would triple it’s value in a week “just because” I would be suspicious.

Re: Why Monero

#183

Post by LeoPanthera »

sdze wrote: post #178

GNU Taler is (for Europeans at least) the most promising system, because it is controllable (at least on the merchant side). The users themself are anonymous, just like when using cash! That is a good system because it enables governments to still being able to tax businesses and control illegal activities. Such system will also gain more acceptance among the common folks. https://taler.net/en/index.html

The important point about Taler is that while the payer is completely anonymous, the payee is not.

This makes illegal uses of it much harder.

Re: Why Monero

#184

Post by JohnJamesRambo »

faeyanpiraat wrote: post #182
Mistletoe wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Monero is one of the truly useful coins and perversely one of the worst performing coins price-wise. There is a horrible lesson in there somewhere about hype and endless promises and markets. https://cryptorank.io/performance

Isn’t a stable price a good thing? If I had a dollar that would triple it’s value in a week “just because” I would be suspicious.

Do you search out stocks that have a stable price?

Re: Why Monero

#185

Post by gojomo »

0des wrote: post #114
gojomo wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except for the de minimus overhead of making-change/breaking-big-bills, physical cash is usually described as 'fungible' in the sense meaningful for economics: each $N is completely equivalent to any other $N – na matter its history or how the tally was subdivided/recombined over time.

That's not what fungible means though. When you start printing numbers on them, they're no longer fungible.

Perhaps pedantically from a particular viewpoint, & if banks used a blacklist of certain bill numbers.

But to financial economists, cash is a textbook example of a ‘fungible’ thing.

So a statement like – “Monero is fungible, cash is not.” – implies you’re using peculiar definitions.

Re: Why Monero

#186

Post by zwirbl »

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #184
faeyanpiraat wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t a stable price a good thing? If I had a dollar that would triple it’s value in a week “just because” I would be suspicious.

Do you search out stocks that have a stable price?

do you pay your groceries with stocks?

Re: Why Monero

#187

Post by csh0 »

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #184
faeyanpiraat wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t a stable price a good thing? If I had a dollar that would triple it’s value in a week “just because” I would be suspicious.

Do you search out stocks that have a stable price?

The same qualities that make a stock or asset desirable (appreciation) make for a bad currency. The expectation of wild appreciation discourages transaction and encourages hoarding.

This is one of the the reasons why (low) target inflation rates exist. The (slight) devaluation of the currency encourages consumption or investment with the currency and discourages mattress stuffing.

You wouldn't buy goods with stocks.

Re: Why Monero

#188

Post by SXX »

bb88 wrote: post #176
SXX wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not a money laundering expert, but when you already using crypto with a huge chance to lose 10-30% on exchange rate flunctations I don't believe it's that hard to come up with an idea. Let's say you'll make a fake startup funded by VCs from all around the world. There is plenty of people who will love to buy few million dollars with 30% discount. This isn't about some petty crime though, but again it's much easie…

> I'm not a money laundering expert. Then why are you regurgitating this uninformed vomit passing as currency expertise? You clearly don't understand how money laundering works with paper cash, and you think the only thing that matters is "cost".

Okay, now this is rude. We're on public forum here sharing our opinions. Mine are based on the fact that I do know how online criminals operate as well as how money laundering work in my country.

I really can't speak about US and how FBI works, but again most of online criminals are not operate in the US.

Re: Why Monero

#189

Post by tootahe45 »

Mistletoe wrote: post #163
stavros wrote: post #2

I'm not really happy promoting a cryptocurrency these days, given that most of them are get-rich-quick schemes, but Monero has been solid for the past 5-6 years that I've been using it. It's completely anonymous, sends quickly, has minimal fees, and it hasn't been as full of cultists as some of the other coins I've seen. I use it to pay for some things and it's always a pleasant experience. I recommend it. The only d…

Monero is one of the truly useful coins and perversely one of the worst performing coins price-wise. There is a horrible lesson in there somewhere about hype and endless promises and markets. https://cryptorank.io/performance

Ever since crypto became mainstream, nobody has cared about things like decentralization and 'the tech'. Binance realized this when they released their centralized alternative to ethereum and the gamblers switched over instantaneously for the lower fees.

Re: Why Monero

#190

Post by gojomo »

enumjorge wrote: post #116
gojomo wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rule of law & democracy began when people had far more privacy than today. The founding motivations for the USA included resisting privacy abuses like 'general warrants' – the state peeking into everyone's business, without specific suspicion, to find criminals. The modern level of financial surveillance – KYC, etc – is only a few decades old, and collects more info for the state than any 'general warrant' could. Eve…

I don't quite follow your logic. The parent comment pointed out that obfuscating financial transactions makes it hard to enforce laws. You responded by saying Monero improves privacy. That might be true, but it doesn't really address the concern about illegal/harmful activity that a current like Monero would enable. I do agree that financial surveillance is an issue, but I'm not sure Monero is the best way to curtail…

“You responded by saying Monero improves privacy.”

I did not mention Monero at all!

I pointed out that “rule of law & democracy” did OK before the recent modern era of massive, preemptive, general-warrant-like financial surveillance. And that level of surveillance may in fact endanger “rule of law & democracy”.

“Why not try passing strong consumer protection laws that ban companies from collecting and selling data on financial transactions as well as tighter restrictions on the access that law enforcement has on this data?”

You are welcome to try that. Why don’t you start in China, Venezuela, Russia, Saudi Arabia, Cuba, Nicaragua? Or even Egypt, Turkey, Iran, Brazil, or India? Protecting financial privacy in those places would help show if your “pass a strong consumer protection law” plan might work.

Even in a country where such a law might have a chance, it’s a fragile protection, & ineffective against most abuses by the state itself. Much better is: built-in, inherent, classic privacy.

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