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Apple threatens UK market exit if court orders 'unacceptable' patent fees

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Re: Apple threatens UK market exit if court orders 'unacceptable' patent fees

#181

Post by lights0123 »

denton-scratch wrote: post #102
mjburgess wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If apple's UK iPhone profits really are in the c. 50mil range, then a (5 to 10)bn fee to remain is commercially non-viable. Note that this is about Apple's ability to sell an iPhone in the UK, and as far as I can see, it wouldnt affect whether the entire company would remain in the UK. If I were apple, I would withdraw a product from a country which supported this kind of racketeering.

Leaving the UK market won't save them licence fees. They've already been incurred. It would be less like relatiation, more like flouncing off in a huff.

> A court case later in July will determine whether Apple will have to make a legally binding pledge to abide by judge-set payout rates in the July 2022 trial

They haven't paid them yet. And if they leave the market, they have no reason to pay it.

Re: Apple threatens UK market exit if court orders 'unacceptable' patent fees

#182

Post by onion2k »

3mr wrote: post #167
cma wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This would mean only mega corporaions capable of funding hundred million dollar FDA trials could have drug patents, and people who came up with novel drug mechanisms would all have to work for these companies rather than specialize on early stage innovative research and sell to them.

Mega corporations capable of funding FDA trials buy patents and use them to create/produce drugs. Patent trolls don't create anything.

Mega corporations capable of funding FDA trials buy patents and use them to create/produce drugs.

They do that sometimes. Other times they discover a drug chemistry, patent it, and then do nothing with it because they decide the market isn't profitable enough. That stops other companies bringing the same drug chemistry to the market. Patent trolls actively want people to exploit their patents in order to sue. I'm not sure which is more disagreeable.

Re: Apple threatens UK market exit if court orders 'unacceptable' patent fees

#183

Post by mjburgess »

ben_w wrote: post #70
mjburgess wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The judiciary isnt supposed to be independent. That is the american system. In the UK all power is held by parliament and extends from parliament.

The power may flow from parliament, but the judiciary is still (supposed to be) independent: • https://www.judiciary.uk/about-the-judiciary/the-judiciary-t... • https://www.judiciary.uk/announcements/swearing-in-of-the-ne...

That is a different sense of the word "independent" than the American "separation of powers" one.

Re: Apple threatens UK market exit if court orders 'unacceptable' patent fees

#184

Post by tsegratis »

I suggest register patents -- so that they become public knowledge

Then anybody can implement it; there is no restriction

Then there is a preset scale, partly set by the value the inventor gives to the invention, but also set by supply and demand. So the inventor cannot price themselves out of the market, but still has incentive to publish. Possibly a market place where companies make non exclusive bids

Patent '''trolls''' are a separate issue

Probably the best solution is for litigants who loose; to pay a more realistic evaluation of damages for the court case to those who successfully defend themselves. This would include paying above damages, because presumably those who defended themselves should be paid for the extra work forced on them, etc

Alternatively for low to zero value patents, where a few years have elapsed, the onus first falls on the patent holder to demonstrate its worth

Re: Apple threatens UK market exit if court orders 'unacceptable' patent fees

#185

Post by LightG »

bb101 wrote: post #77
arcturus17 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can certainly imagine the UK doing well in some tech niches, but not in high-end, global scale consumer electronics like Apple, no. The high-end mobile phone market outside Apple is a shark-infested red ocean to start with. Then there's the fact that even if Apple stopped operating in the UK, you'd still have to compete with them globally. I cannot foresee a Black Swan event like a random dude from the Midlands bec…

To be fair, a random dude from Essex designed the original iMac, iPod and most Apple devices thereafter.

The British create and design around ideas but don't have the capital markets, the scale, or the will to leverage them globally.

They end up selling themselves and their ideas to the world who then go on to really capitalise on them.

Being generous, Britain is a design hub at best.

Re: Apple threatens UK market exit if court orders 'unacceptable' patent fees

#186

Post by ben_w »

mjburgess wrote: post #183
ben_w wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The power may flow from parliament, but the judiciary is still (supposed to be) independent: • https://www.judiciary.uk/about-the-judiciary/the-judiciary-t... • https://www.judiciary.uk/announcements/swearing-in-of-the-ne...

That is a different sense of the word "independent" than the American "separation of powers" one.

Does that make a difference? What I said was they are “supposed to be independent” in the broader context of saying the politicians shouldn’t censure the judges, but might anyway.

Re: Apple threatens UK market exit if court orders 'unacceptable' patent fees

#187

Post by jbluepolarbear »

joshuaissac wrote: post #175
jbluepolarbear wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Licensing is providing a product through 3rd party. I’m talking about a holder that has just sat on the patent and no product has been developed from its issue.

If no product is ever developed, then there is no licensing or infringement. A troll may still try to use it to suppress some other product but that can be done regardless of whether a product is developed. I looked at one of the patents from the Apple case, US6393286B1. Unlike the "small fry" scenarios described above, this was registered by Ericsson. I cannot tell whether the patent is actually inventive, but it se…

I just looked up the patent and I now support Apple 100%. That patent is nothing. Like what even is the patent? Measure communication between mobile terminals? What is the patent protecting? What process has been described that’s been violated? I was giving the patent the benefit of the doubt, but that patent is superfluous. Is it the specific radio frequency? Is it specific to mobile phones? Was it proved that this was a unique invention that couldn’t be confused with a different method?

What product did Apple make that specifically infringes on this patent?

Re: Apple threatens UK market exit if court orders 'unacceptable' patent fees

#188

Post by vmception »

esperent wrote: post #180
vmception wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jobs? Whether from the company directly or third parties Such as the market for accessories creation and trading All helps GDP and the local economy

Job creation is not a good enough reason to let a mega corporation threaten the rule of law in your country.

I agree

and the immediately following politician will run on a jobs platform and invite the corporation back

I like being on the corporate side of the game right now

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