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On Smoking

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Re: On Smoking

#181

Post by mdoms »

qayxc wrote: post #80
mdoms wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I smoked for 10 years and quitting was difficult (but not THAT difficult - don't even get me started on the "it's harder than quitting heroin" nonsense). But now, 9 years since quitting, I don't even think about it anymore. It doesn't follow me around, I don't constantly fight the urge to smoke. I'm not "always" an addict. It's gone. It's in my past.

> don't even get me started on the "it's harder than quitting heroin" nonsense) Out of curiosity: did you try both to know that for fact?

No, but if that was all there was to heroin I don't think we'd be seeing people destroying their families and literally throwing their lives away for it. Quitting smoking was a few weeks of feeling a bit shitty followed by a few months of constant cravings followed by almost forgetting you ever smoked.

Re: On Smoking

#182

Post by eyelidlessness »

koyote wrote: post #119
TchoBeer wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alcohol is also addictive expensive and bad for you, and yet no one asks why anyone would drink alcohol

Alcohol has gourmet attributes and is a good social lubricant. The question is more around whether those two attributes warrant ingesting what is essentially poison. I don't think I've ever heard a cigarette smoker comment on the taste of their cigarette (cigars are the exception here) and the high, especially for regular smokers, is near non-existent. So for cigarettes the initial appeal is much less obvious. I'd as…

Not responding as an argument, just to share my perspective (as I’m holding a lit cigarette in my hand).

I’ve definitely described the flavor of my cigarettes. I switched to my current brand because I liked the flavor more than my previous brand, which I described as having no flavor (and of course it did, just not flavor I found offputting), which was preferable to previous brands I’d smoked. I’m leaving out brand names here mostly because this is a way we reinforce our addiction and I don’t want to give anyone inspiration to try something else.

I have only once smoked to address social pressure. I was 12 at the time, I hated it, no one pressured further. When I started smoking of my own volition, I was 15. I did it privately out of curiosity because I was terribly bored. I didn’t like it, then I did it out of habit. It happened like that.

Re: On Smoking

#183

Post by mdoms »

simondotau wrote: post #150
becquerel wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to write short stories that didn't contain the letter 'e', inspired by George Perec's book La Disparition (cracking novel, highly recommended -- all the translations from French keep it up as well). It's challenging, obviously, but also forces you to employ very unusual and unique language.

I concur. It's difficult, impractical and making my brain hurt. A grasp of (and availability of) synonym information is vitally important.

Imprssiv.

Re: On Smoking

#184

Post by antisceptic »

murat131 wrote: post #3

The thing about smoking is that when you quit smoking you quit it every day. Imagine a light switch on the wall. You turn it off by quitting smoking and you can always go back at a desperate time for instance and turn it on. And some time later off again. Smoking your first cigarette implants that light switch on your mind and you can't make it go away. Since you know how it makes you feel good when the switch is on,…

I think your analogy works well mechanistically, but it doesn't go deep enough with that "Switch". If nicotine is a switch then that switch does something. That switch puts you in a more positive mood, eliminates negative self-talk, increases cognitive function. There is a reason people flip that switch.

The reason people smoke isn't simply that they're a bunch of junkies, it's that nicotine is perceived as a solution for their problems. For many people, it is too much hassle to identify the true causes of their need for nicotine, whether it's that they don't feel fluid enough or they feel overwhelmed emotionally. There are ways to fix those core problems in one's life, but to many, using nicotine might seem simpler or quicker.

People seem to think smokers enjoy torching up their nicotine sticks and fouling up the air for everyone else. In reality they are just self medicating. It is worse for them in the long run, but classically it is difficult for an unrealized long term reward to outcompete a short term gain whose effects are immediately apparent.

Re: On Smoking

#185

Post by pstuart »

Baeocystin wrote: post #169
mavhc wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do people start smoking? Surely they know it's addictive, expensive, and bad for you

I don't smoke, but my roommate does. After living in the same house for a couple of years, now, I think I understand the social aspect of why people start. A cigarette break is the perfect amount of time to sit down and have a little chat, and provides a reason to stop once it's done, too. Meet on the deck, catch up on each other's day, see you later, back to work. That kind of thing.

That's the only thing I miss about smoking.

Re: On Smoking

#186

Post by throwawayboise »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #174
koyote wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alcohol has gourmet attributes and is a good social lubricant. The question is more around whether those two attributes warrant ingesting what is essentially poison. I don't think I've ever heard a cigarette smoker comment on the taste of their cigarette (cigars are the exception here) and the high, especially for regular smokers, is near non-existent. So for cigarettes the initial appeal is much less obvious. I'd as…

I quit smoking over 40 years ago (TL;DR: It sucked). Best decision I ever made. I don’t regret it one bit. To this day, I sometimes smell a nearby cigarette, and it smells good to me.

My dad smoked through my entire childhood. I don't like the smell of stale cigarette smoke, but smoke drifting from a lit cigarette smells good to me, and reminds me of being around my dad as a kid.

Re: On Smoking

#187

Post by jasonwatkinspdx »

murat131 wrote: post #3

The thing about smoking is that when you quit smoking you quit it every day. Imagine a light switch on the wall. You turn it off by quitting smoking and you can always go back at a desperate time for instance and turn it on. And some time later off again. Smoking your first cigarette implants that light switch on your mind and you can't make it go away. Since you know how it makes you feel good when the switch is on,…

Your argument above is mistaken.

It's a major factor in why my 80+ year old father is about to go into his 4th open heart surgery, having had a pacemaker the last 2 of those.

He still smokes. He refuses to quit because he sees it as an all or nothing precipice as you characterize above.

Quitting smoking is not some impossible mountain to climb. Talk to your doctor. What works for you will be context dependent. It does work, as proven by people every day. The answer to physiological dependency is time delay + taper down. The psychological re-enforcement loop will break and fade away.

I have done this and am not speaking in terms of hypotheticals.

You could not force me to smoke in any way. I will physically retch at the thought.

Please do not falsely portray quitting smoking as some eternal struggle. In fact, once you do it, it fades within a comparatively short time.

Re: On Smoking

#188

Post by throwawayboise »

defaultname wrote: post #131
rkk3 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Smoking is magnitudes more addictive than alcohol. No it is not magnitudes more addictive. Alcohol is extremely addictive, 1 in 12 Adults in the US has an alcohol problem [1] and withdrawal can literally kill you, unlike nicotine. 1. https://www.ncadd.org/about-addiction/alcohol

Your stats in absolutely no way counters my claim about addiction. Almost everyone who smokes to any degree becomes addicted and a regular user. Tens (100 million+) of millions of Americans drink occasionally with no addiction. Alcohol is a dangerous drug in every dimension, and I specifically said that. But their addiction profiles are dramatically different.

I used to smoke occasionally. Only when I was drinking, as a matter of fact. I never became a regular smoker. I also don't smoke at all anymore, even when drinking.

Re: On Smoking

#189

Post by SilverRed »

sillysaurusx wrote: post #125
deesep wrote: post #86

I started smoking when i went to study in China. Someone gifted me an expensive brand of cigarette, and I kept it hidden in a drawer for two weeks as I didn't smoke. One very cold day with no where to go and nothing to do, I took the pack out and lit one stick. My did it have a lovely scent. The heat it created inside me was also soothing. It took me about a week and half to finish the pack of 21 cigs. I couldn't aff…

Related to this, a lot of the reason smokers around me smoke is to just go outside. It’s an excuse to hang out on the porch. You might think that such a societal excuse isn’t needed, but it’s a powerful force.

This is why I love working from home. I'll go outside whenever I want and no one will know or try to stop me. As long as stuff keeps getting done, no one cares. Sometimes I just need 10 mins to prune some bonsai trees to feel refreshed enough to continue for the day.

Re: On Smoking

#190

Post by throwawayboise »

nine_k wrote: post #97
TchoBeer wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alcohol is also addictive expensive and bad for you, and yet no one asks why anyone would drink alcohol

To get physiologically addicted to alcohol, one has to drink heavily every day for a year or so. Few people, especially people with college education, do that. One can drink a glass of wine or a cocktail every weekend for life, and form no addiction at all. Such a person can go dry for weeks or months, without any adverse effects. Nicotine forms a physiological addiction much faster, and then the addict has to have a…

I'd say many people can drink more than that without dependency. I have a whiskey most evenings, but if I run out, I don't have any problems. Sometimes I'll go days or weeks without a drink, just depending on what else is going on.
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