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Why Do People Stay Poor? [pdf]

sticerd.lse.ac.uk

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Re: Why Do People Stay Poor? [pdf]

#181

Post by ellis-bell »

bmmayer1 wrote: post #174

Here's a better question: how do people become rich? Being poor is table stakes for being a human animal. The miracle of modern society is that billions of people aren't poor (as high as 90% according to Hans Rosling[1]). How did we make that happen? How do we make it happen for everyone? [1] https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/distribution-of-populatio...

correct, 90% of people make more than $1.90 ppp according to the data. but only 35% make more than $10 a day.

the poverty line is defined generously at ~$2 / day by most oecd countries, but making above the poverty line does not make you not poor.

all of that said, the field of development economics has been very rich in research these days, particular from the likes of duflo and banerjee

Re: Why Do People Stay Poor? [pdf]

#182

Post by SilasX »

Guest42 wrote: post #170
SilasX wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If so, turn it into a perpetually profitable self-funding charity that fronts the poor the money to get the cheaper option in return for a cut of the savings. It's probably not possible because there are factors other than what you described.

Are there specific issues that you have with the comment and deeper insights than those described? If so, what are they, and what data do you have to support them?

Yes, the insight that the comment implies there's an easy source of free money that also lifts everyone out of poverty with little effort. Do you not count that as an insight? Were you aware of that implication before seeing my comment? Is there a reason you need copious data to back up my comment but not the original one?

Re: Why Do People Stay Poor? [pdf]

#184

Post by zouhair »

redorb wrote: post #165
jfrunyon wrote: post #143

Easy answer: because expenses are higher for poor people. Instead of buying a home, the lower class rent their whole life. Instead of their daddy giving them a home, the middle class pay interest on a mortgage most of their life. Instead of buying a 20-pack of $necessary_product that costs $20 and will last for months, the lower class buy a 2-pack that costs $5 and lasts a couple weeks because they need the $15 to pa…

This is a great definition of what I consider to be the 'poor tax'.. Not to mention if they ever get un-poor they don't have the knowledge to 'build wealth' until they start slowly learning it or from a mentor. We would better off teaching 'home finances, interest and banking' classes instead of Algebra 3 or geometry 2 (for 99% of people)

That's the only way to have billionaires. They have to take the money where it is, mostly in poor people's pockets.

Re: Why Do People Stay Poor? [pdf]

#185

Post by dlhavema »

redorb wrote: post #165
jfrunyon wrote: post #143

Easy answer: because expenses are higher for poor people. Instead of buying a home, the lower class rent their whole life. Instead of their daddy giving them a home, the middle class pay interest on a mortgage most of their life. Instead of buying a 20-pack of $necessary_product that costs $20 and will last for months, the lower class buy a 2-pack that costs $5 and lasts a couple weeks because they need the $15 to pa…

This is a great definition of what I consider to be the 'poor tax'.. Not to mention if they ever get un-poor they don't have the knowledge to 'build wealth' until they start slowly learning it or from a mentor. We would better off teaching 'home finances, interest and banking' classes instead of Algebra 3 or geometry 2 (for 99% of people)

Very true

Re: Why Do People Stay Poor? [pdf]

#186

Post by bumby »

tstrimple wrote: post #155
missedthecue wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why have the poor gotten richer over time then? We don't have the same percentage of rich and poor as we always have had.

Poor people aren't really poor because they almost all have a refrigerator and an iPhone is not as compelling an argument as you may think. There are very real and very extreme examples* of poverty in this country that are inexcusable. * https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/sep/05/hookworm-low...

What do you personally think is a better metric for poverty? Something like access to quality healthcare?

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...

Re: Why Do People Stay Poor? [pdf]

#187

Post by panopticon »

DubiousPusher wrote: post #145
ip26 wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you [...] can't afford maintaining them Not sure I can entirely agree, when I was broke I had a fair amount of free time and I spent a lot of it learning to repair motor vehicles. Parts are not free, but labor & markup is most of the cost anyway.

> when I was broke I had a fair amount of free time How did you manage this? I was working my ass off just to keep the bills paid and doing chores to avoid costly services like dining out and maintenance.

I imagine a lot of it depends on your lifestyle too. I have an old friend that only works enough to bankroll his skiing and biking. No kids or other "adult responsibilities", and he lives extremely frugally (favors and freebies are his bread and butter).

Re: Why Do People Stay Poor? [pdf]

#188

Post by quercusgrisea »

credit_guy wrote: post #172
arcticbull wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think what you've identified is that the poor have gotten better off due to technical innovations reducing the price of basic goods and enhancing their functionality -- while on average wages have tracked inflation. This is a systemic improvement. Meanwhile, the rich have gotten exponentially richer, as public policies have shifted ever more in their favor. For much the 1900s the top income tax bracket in the US wa…

> The poor have gotten slightly better off, the wealthy have gotten dramatically better off, and the gap between the two has widened. That's a fairly common perception. Most often summarized in "the rich get richer, the poor poorer" (at least on a relative basis). I was born in a Communist country, and I have another perception. Poverty has different levels. The most abject poverty is when you go hungry. My family di…

Food insecurity is not specific to communist countries, it's a massive problem in capitalist countries today. The US is the richest country in the world and 37 million people experienced food insecurity in 2018 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunger_in_the_United_States

Re: Why Do People Stay Poor? [pdf]

#189

Post by swiley »

Guest42 wrote: post #170
SilasX wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If so, turn it into a perpetually profitable self-funding charity that fronts the poor the money to get the cheaper option in return for a cut of the savings. It's probably not possible because there are factors other than what you described.

Are there specific issues that you have with the comment and deeper insights than those described? If so, what are they, and what data do you have to support them?

Buying a car.

If you don’t own a car in the US and don’t live in a place like NyC you will be destitute. You will have no way to get food and no way to get to work (and therefore pay rent.) Most people in the US could afford to actually save money if they didn’t have to pay (including interest!) on the loans they have to take out to buy a (crappy and used often!) car.

Re: Why Do People Stay Poor? [pdf]

#190

Post by frickinLasers »

SilasX wrote: post #182
Guest42 wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are there specific issues that you have with the comment and deeper insights than those described? If so, what are they, and what data do you have to support them?

Yes, the insight that the comment implies there's an easy source of free money that also lifts everyone out of poverty with little effort. Do you not count that as an insight? Were you aware of that implication before seeing my comment? Is there a reason you need copious data to back up my comment but not the original one?

The OP implies no such thing.
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