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Career advice for people with bad luck

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Re: Career advice for people with bad luck

#181

I really want to see more articles like this on HN. However, this is really "career advice for people at struggling companies." The luck part doesn't get discussed in the way I expected. To me, bad luck is things like: - You're in the wrong place at the wrong time. Ex. you graduated in 2008-2010/now or your business sector got wiped out by COVID - Despite your best efforts at networking, you simply never meet that ma…

I found this helpful when I'm in a rut:

Recommit to doing everything right, with a focus on the little things. Not just work or life. Daily routine and small chores. If you loose focus, acknowledge it and move on.

Focus on what's most important. Don't do anything else until what's most important is done. This helps stop overworking, scrubbing every bit of the kitchen when you should be getting clients or spending time with family.

Once your confidence builds up, take a real look at the top businesses.

Rich and famous?

Or just the public face of a lot of other people's hard work.

That's good! You have to be happy for other people's success. It's a luxury.

A really good credit card makes up a lot of business today. One good client pays the bills. Everything else likely gets a no. Getting a look even if it ends in a no is quite an accomplishment.

It's a fight at the top. A bad one. Some people want to do horrible things. Our side convinces people to pursue peace and knowledge. Sometimes you're just not ready.

There's someone here talking about a 6 month gap in their resume. The job interview is not a court of law. Just say:

"I had my own clients." > "oh yeah? How that go?" "Good! I made more money with them." > "Huh. So why you quit?" "I sold it. I sold the business."

Don't sell yourself short. Don't cheerlead either. Hindsight always makes you feel bad. Decide, and stick to the script no matter what. Admitting to mistakes and relating to people are for the ones at the top of the food chain. They might as well be in a different universe.

Also, there's the killer cold outbreak. If you're willing to work, I think they'll take you. A lot of people well off are not going to risk it. They'll go back home and take care of their family.

Re: Career advice for people with bad luck

#182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something similar happened to me during this outbreak. Got my CS degree from a no-name university in a third world country a few years back, got a job in one of those software sweatshops getting paid peanuts, moved to a new one an year later where I worked my ass off to learn things and generally be a good developer, but here too I was paid a pittance, mostly due to my education and previous job. I hated working here…

comment looks fine to me?

It can be brought back to life if people vouch for it, so I assume that’s what happened.

Re: Career advice for people with bad luck

#183

Step 1: Get a well paying job at a big tech company. There is very little luck involved in this, just get really good at algorithms. No need for a famous school, specific degree etc. It requires intelligence, if you don't have that then you need luck. Step 2: Save more than two thirds of your take home salary, you can still live way better than the people sweeping the office floor. Step 3: You now have a ton of money…

> Step 1: Get a well paying job at a big tech company. There is very little luck involved in this, just get really good at algorithms. No need for a famous school, specific degree etc. It requires intelligence, if you don't have that then you need luck.

Sorry but no. Like everyone else has pointed out, this is so far from the truth that I’m actually in awe that someone would write this.

There is a ton of luck involved with getting a job at a good tech company. First being something straight up mentioned in the article - knowing the right people. The chances of a regular hard working person getting past even the initial resume filter takes luck. It takes luck for a referral to find the right hiring manager’s desk.

Get past that and then depending on the company, there’s always the chance that someone interviewing you is having a bad day or maybe the team “fit” isn’t there.

There are a ton of obstacles that come down to luck because it is possible to commit no mistakes and still lose.

Edit: Since many people are using anecdotal data and survivorship bias as proof that this is true, how about a counter point. I interviewed at a FAANG before and didn’t get the job. Later on, I met someone who works at that company who was able to look me up. I had passed their bar. Not with flying colors but well enough that you would generally get an offer. Why didn’t I? Because that specific team that interviewed me had a skillset need that I didn’t have. But there’s no way of knowing that prior because the job description doesn’t point that out. It’s just how their (and most companies’) process works. So like I said, luck.

Re: Career advice for people with bad luck

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Any reasonably good programmer can get a job at a FANG company with three months of serious study; any reasonably intelligent person can become a good entry-level programmer with 1-2 years of serious study. The demand for engineers far outstrips supply.

I've been studying for the past two years and have failed at multiple FAANGs, some twice. Failed at FB, NFLX, AMZN, in addition to MSFT and UBER. Then again, I'm not entry level (10 yoe), so I might be competing at a higher bar. However, I'd gladly join any of these companies as a junior engineer without hesitation. I've seen stories of, amongst others, someone who studied while in prison get into GOOG, someone who w…

This is a particular kind of challenge that definitely occurs for more experienced engineers, however I also suspect you have a stronger foundation than you realize and could shine with some specific guidance.

A buddy and I provide all kinds of practice interviews to help engineers get into FAANGs. We work on a success based payment model, and help substantially with negotiations, too.

If you're interested send me a note with availability for a chat (email and website in profile). I would love to at least offer some advice for next time even you decide our coaching is not for you.

Re: Career advice for people with bad luck

#185
post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hiring is still going on in most of North America. Hedge your bets look at other companies and interview. Preparation for one interview is preparation for lots of them

Unfortunately US work visa for people from my country is not so easy. Though I've been applying at companies in EU, the visa process is much simpler.

Take a look at Japan as well, really easy to get in to work but money is not as good as NA. I don’t really know EU market

Re: Career advice for people with bad luck

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Any reasonably good programmer can get a job at a FANG company with three months of serious study; any reasonably intelligent person can become a good entry-level programmer with 1-2 years of serious study. The demand for engineers far outstrips supply.

This is kind of depressing for me. I've failed interviews at Amazon, MS, Google and Netflix. I studied a bunch and managed to get 5/5 on all but one section of the TripleByte test.

Don't be. There's a lot of luck involved in the interview process and most people who had luck on their side won't understand this.

Re: Career advice for people with bad luck

#187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Any reasonably good programmer can get a job at a FANG company with three months of serious study; any reasonably intelligent person can become a good entry-level programmer with 1-2 years of serious study. The demand for engineers far outstrips supply.

I've been studying for the past two years and have failed at multiple FAANGs, some twice. Failed at FB, NFLX, AMZN, in addition to MSFT and UBER. Then again, I'm not entry level (10 yoe), so I might be competing at a higher bar. However, I'd gladly join any of these companies as a junior engineer without hesitation. I've seen stories of, amongst others, someone who studied while in prison get into GOOG, someone who w…

Same here. I’ve considered wiping my resume and leaving off my background intentionally just to get the chance to interview at the entry/junior level. Of course, those positions are now mostly exclusively reserved for those coming out of college. So unless you have the income and time to go get another CS degree, you still can’t apply.

This is all assuming you can get past the resume filter which is all luck unless you know someone with enough pull within the company already.

Re: Career advice for people with bad luck

#188
post #152

Step 1: Get a well paying job at a big tech company. There is very little luck involved in this, just get really good at algorithms. No need for a famous school, specific degree etc. It requires intelligence, if you don't have that then you need luck. Step 2: Save more than two thirds of your take home salary, you can still live way better than the people sweeping the office floor. Step 3: You now have a ton of money…

I've heard of people who did this and went on to retire. OTOH I don't know of any engineer who left Big Tech to take advantage of their financial security to do something _highly impactful_. In other words, the "Google mafia" was a lot weaker than the "Paypal mafia". The problem is this : most creative engineers don't have the mindset to mindlessly study for algorithms interviews, only to then have to spend years in…

> most creative engineers don't have the mindset to mindlessly study for algorithms interviews, only to then have to spend years in constrained engineering roles.

I agree with this, but then they can't really complain about luck when they had the option to fix it. It was a choice they made and now they have to live with it. It is fine to gamble, but then you shouldn't complain about the outcome if you lose.

Re: Career advice for people with bad luck

#189
post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Step 1: Move to SV. What about... - I don't want to move to SV, I'm not that young anymore. - I don't want to move outside my country, or - specifically to the US and SV, which are not a particularly good place to live in anyway, or - even if I wanted it, entry to the US is stressful and not that easy, or - I have friends/family ties where I live, and those are important to me There's plenty of reasons why your ste…

No pain no gain. If the US and SV opportunities aren't a type of gain that's compelling to you then of course you dont need to worry about it. But if they are, then you need to make your own luck by making those sacrifices. Things about family ties and wants and stress are all part of the work you put in to make your own luck. Being American is a pretty great gig, for all the stuff you keep hearing on the news. There…

> No pain no gain. If the US and SV opportunities aren't a type of gain that's compelling to you then of course you dont need to worry about it

There are many reasons why this might be out if your control, beyond visa requirements. Maybe you have dependents your can’t bring with you (sick or elderly family for example), or maybe your SO has a job that’s hard to move. Or you have a family and can’t afford the crazy SV rent for a place large enough.

Re: Career advice for people with bad luck

#190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, 1 make money, 2 save it, 3 congrats you have lots of money. Thought-provoking.

Yeah, step 2 sounds easy, but is actually the hardest. I know plenty of folks who had well paying jobs, but quickly blew it all on boats, multiple luxury cars, investing in their cousin's hot startup, etc.

Sounds horrible, poor guy.
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