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U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

latimes.com

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Re: U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

#181

Post by Jamwinner »

ceejayoz wrote: post #33
donatj wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To quote the article: > It’s vinegar, essentially. To say that’s unsafe or not to be used, we don’t think there’s a basis for that in sound science. If you're fine with using vinegar elsewhere in food, you should be fine with this.

I'm fine with vinegar in my salad dressing, but I'm not OK with the chef using it to clean his hands in the place of soap+water. Sanitized poop is still poop. I'd rather the poop not be there at all, as much as possible.

You'd better not look any closer in to sanitization standards in the food industry then... plenty of sanitized (rat) poop.

Re: U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

#182

Post by lexs »

pintxo wrote: post #129
joecool1029 wrote: post #42

So, I fail to see the issue with the chemical currently used. Chlorine had obvious negative health issues, but peracetic acid and hydrogen peroxide both decay quickly when exposed to air: http://www.foodprotection.org/files/food-protection-trends/m... I understand the concerns about using such processes over having a clean processing facility but I don't trust the cheap labor (prisoners, migrant farmers, etc) the US…

The (socialist) European way then would be to regulate the industry, to ensure certain standards. Basically trying to attack at the root of the problem instead of the outcome. We are not necessarily very good at it, but we try and it does work reasonably well on average.

What exactly is socialist about this?

Re: U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

#183

Post by Jamwinner »

uhtred wrote: post #172
jessaustin wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is similar to people who claim to be agnostics rather than atheists. There's nothing wrong with atheism per se , but no reasonable person wants to start any discussion by admitting, "I'm an asshole!"

Of course there's nothing wrong with atheism, it's rational. People who believe in God are the assholes.

Thanks for nailing the point home. Can we just go about our day without insulting people without knowing them? The range of human experince is too vast to be constrained to any one belief system, of which athieism is just another class of variations.

Re: U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

#184

Post by pintxo »

lexs wrote: post #182
pintxo wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The (socialist) European way then would be to regulate the industry, to ensure certain standards. Basically trying to attack at the root of the problem instead of the outcome. We are not necessarily very good at it, but we try and it does work reasonably well on average.

What exactly is socialist about this?

Sorry, forgot the /s on "socialist". Just being a bit snarky about anything government related easily painted as socialism in some subsets of the US population.

Re: U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

#185

Post by mzs »

jkh1 wrote: post #169

Chlorine treatment can make bacteria undetectable by inducing a dormant state [1] so some earlier studies on effectiveness of chemical treatments may not be valid. Also the US and EU have different approaches to meat production. In the EU, the principle is to prevent meat contamination in the first place throughout the food production chain whereas in the US emphasis is placed on decontamination at the end of the cha…

They are proposing the use of peracetic acid instead of chlorine.

Re: U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

#186

Post by tptacek »

rayiner wrote: post #110
magduf wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I'm not sure we can trust US resident's opinions on taste as long as Hershey's chocolate still exists. As an American, I agree with you 100%. Our opinions on taste are utterly worthless. It's not just Hershey's chocolate either (which is already bad enough), it's so many other foods that are commonplace here. Food quality in this country is abysmal. You can get great food here, but it's harder to find and you'll pay…

Hershey’s chocolate is fine, so is American cheese. (You’d be insane to make S’mores or a grilled cheese with anything else, and if you don’t like those things you’re unamerican and should just move to Europe.)

Hershey's chocolate is pretty bad, and American cheese is barely cheese. But both have functional properties that make them desirable for some applications: it's difficult to make a truly good cheeseburger without American cheese because of its melting properties, for instance. That's also why people use it in grilled cheeses, although it's less essential there (swiss melts just fine on a sandwich, for instance), and you should at the very least probably add some shredded cheddar or something to your American in a grilled cheese.

You can add American's functional properties to almost any cheese with sodium citrate powder (we make and slice up baking sheets worth of "Americanized" aged cheddars, gruyere, and even blue).

I would not confuse these useful properties with goodness. Grapeseed oil is also extremely useful. But California olive oil is a better oil. American cheese is like the grapeseed of cheese.

Re: U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

#187

Post by triceratops »

rayiner wrote: post #110
magduf wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I'm not sure we can trust US resident's opinions on taste as long as Hershey's chocolate still exists. As an American, I agree with you 100%. Our opinions on taste are utterly worthless. It's not just Hershey's chocolate either (which is already bad enough), it's so many other foods that are commonplace here. Food quality in this country is abysmal. You can get great food here, but it's harder to find and you'll pay…

Hershey’s chocolate is fine, so is American cheese. (You’d be insane to make S’mores or a grilled cheese with anything else, and if you don’t like those things you’re unamerican and should just move to Europe.)

If you've only had good grilled cheeses with American cheese in them, I feel bad for you - truly. A good grilled cheese is one of life's greatest pleasures. There are many different kinds of cheeses that can go into a good grilled cheese.

Re: U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

#188

Post by ceejayoz »

Jamwinner wrote: post #181
ceejayoz wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm fine with vinegar in my salad dressing, but I'm not OK with the chef using it to clean his hands in the place of soap+water. Sanitized poop is still poop. I'd rather the poop not be there at all, as much as possible.

You'd better not look any closer in to sanitization standards in the food industry then... plenty of sanitized (rat) poop.

There's a substantial difference between "a certain amount of contamination is basically unavoidable" and "we could raise chickens more humanely like the Europeans do but choose not to for more profits".

Re: U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

#189

Post by triceratops »

Will_Parker wrote: post #71
jfengel wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think they're saying that poor people shouldn't be coerced by a subsidy system to eat food that has to be chemically treated to remove pathogens, and which causes animal suffering which most people would reject if it weren't kept hidden. There are plenty of ways for poor people to eat healthy diets without harming animals. It's a perverse incentive of the system that grows vast quantities of poor-quality corn and s…

> The US in particular is wedded to the notion that meat is essential and primary food, and it set up its entire agriculture industry to making that cheap Nothing is particular about the US here, humans are omnivores whose optimal diet for health contains both meat and plants.

> omnivores whose optimal diet for health contains both meat and plants.

Vegetarians can be, and usually are, just as healthy as meat eaters. And no optimal diet contains meat in the quantity Americans eat on average. Japan has barely 1/3rd the per-capita meat consumption with better life expectancy and health.

Re: U.S. wants the EU to accept chemical-washed chicken as part of trade deal

#190

Post by paganel »

crazypyro wrote: post #174
paganel wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US imported food has been the stuff of jokes in my country for almost 20 years now, even before we entered the EU, and we are an Eastern-European country with all sorts of other problems. Can’t really understand how can many US commenters say that US food is as good and healthy as European food with a straight face.

Isn't it obvious the stuff that gets imported isn't the same stuff that all Americans eat? The US isn't exactly exporting tons of fresh food all the way to Eastern Europe. Of course its gonna be mostly packaged, mass produced crap....

Hence why we're against treating said "mostly packaged, mass produced crap" the same as local European food.
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