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CNLabelContactRelation​YoungerCousin​MothersSiblingsDaughter​OrFathersSistersDaughter

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Re: CNLabelContactRelation​YoungerCousin​MothersSiblingsDaughter​OrFathersSistersDaughter

#181

Post by TimTheTinker »

bildung wrote: post #160
jperry wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is slightly absurd. It's reporting a very minor bug, not offering to implement a whole feature. Are you saying that no-one should report anything because it encourages them to let bugs slide into production?

> Are you saying that no-one should report anything because it encourages them to let bugs slide into production? No, of course not :) That would indeed be absurd. What I meant was this particular case. Apple of all companies is by no means incapable of hiring people to deliver quality. They make billions upon billions by avoiding taxes[0] and shifting production to deleloping countries [1]. If a company like this le…

Apple's bread-and-butter is products. To the extent that they shift their focus from their products, they jeopardize profits and every other measure of business success.

Good QA is part of being focused on products. So our response (or lack of response) to glitches like this in their software is very unlikely to affect their overall approach. Either they're product-focused or not: if they are, they'll be profitable and QA will be good. If not, they'll eventually fade away anyway.

... All to say, if you want to see issues like this fixed, I suggest reporting them and not worrying about it.

Re: CNLabelContactRelation​YoungerCousin​MothersSiblingsDaughter​OrFathersSistersDaughter

#182

Post by [deleted] »

a3n wrote: post #175
toxik wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try making a five year old say ”maternal grandfather,” other languages have two-syllable words for all of these, like the Chinese words for which these are made.

Five year olds get along fine with whatever practices their family uses, for a five year old's life.

[deleted]

Re: CNLabelContactRelation​YoungerCousin​MothersSiblingsDaughter​OrFathersSistersDaughter

#183

Post by duskwuff »

lostphilosopher wrote: post #148
princekolt wrote: post #133

Why is everyone assuming this is about Chinese??? CN is the class prefix for the Contacts.framework library, like every other Apple API. For example: CoreLocation: CL (CLLocation) SpriteKit: SK (SKScene) CloudKit: CK (CKRecord) CoreVideo: CV (CVBuffer) LocalAuthentication: LA (LAContext) So on and so forth...

It's not about the "CN" bit. People are talking about why the variable exists at all. Essentially the reason being ventured is that that relationship has a specific name and meaning in Chinese with no English equivalent beyond an exacting familial definition. Imagine trying to express "grandfather" in a language that doesn't have the concept. You might end up with "father's father." (I know nothing about Chinese. Jus…

> Imagine trying to express "grandfather" in a language that doesn't have the concept.

Or, for a more concrete example: "daughter-in-law". Many of the English "-in-law" relations may seem foreign to cultures with different conceptions of the extended family.

Re: CNLabelContactRelation​YoungerCousin​MothersSiblingsDaughter​OrFathersSistersDaughter

#184

Post by dang »

toxik wrote: post #162
benj111 wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You say Maternal/Paternal Grandparents, or add last names, or use different names (eg Granny and Nana). I can't think of a situation where I've had to differentiate them as relatives, only as individuals, so I can't see a distinction being that useful.

Really, you’re going to defend this lack of precision? I’m sure you can get by but having precise words is rarely a loss. Anglocentric superiority complex eh.

Please don't break the site guidelines by adding personal swipes to an argument.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: CNLabelContactRelation​YoungerCousin​MothersSiblingsDaughter​OrFathersSistersDaughter

#185

Post by yongjik »

TorKlingberg wrote: post #109

I can see why this is needed. English has very broad words for relatives like "grandfather" or "aunt". Most languages have more specific words, especially Chinese where there are separate words for fathers or mothers side, older or younger and sibling or siblings spouse. You also often use these relation words rather than their names when referring to a relatives. If this code was in Chinese, they would all be short…

Similarly, English words "brother" and "sister" are sliced into five words in Korean:

    Elder sister of a girl
    Elder brother of a girl
    Elder sister of a boy
    Elder brother of a boy
    Younger sibling of whatever gender
So every time a "brother" or "sister" appears in English, a translator has to figure out their relative age, or make a wild guess.

Re: CNLabelContactRelation​YoungerCousin​MothersSiblingsDaughter​OrFathersSistersDaughter

#186

Post by stevekemp »

c3534l wrote: post #60
TimTheTinker wrote: post #33

At first glance this looked like a code smell, but after some reflection I can't think of a cleaner, more readable way to uniquely identify each possible relationship -- especially in a strongly-typed language with an IDE. Here's the full list: https://developer.apple.com/documentation/contacts/contacts_...

You need an intermediate representation (like a tree) rather than attempt to brute force every possible permutation up until some arbitrary point. Even if that weren't the case, it'd be better to give it a more obscure name or create some kind of naming system and then document it rather than demonstrate why self-documenting code can become self-defeating if taken to an extreme.

Trees can't be used for relationships, due to the crazy things that people can do with each other. You'll need a DAG, and you'll need to detect cycles.

https://stackoverflow.com/questions/6163683/cycles-in-family...

Re: CNLabelContactRelation​YoungerCousin​MothersSiblingsDaughter​OrFathersSistersDaughter

#187

Post by eridius »

School-Cotton wrote: post #168
eridius wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no idea what "BiaoJie" is (well, in context, I assume it's a romanization of the pronunciation of 表姐), so that name would be completely unhelpful. Whereas the current name describes the relationship such that I can understand it, even if I don't know why this particular relationship is deserving of a name. Something like CNBiaoJie also assumes that Chinese is the only language that names this relationship, and…

I have no idea what ElderCousinMothersSiblingsDaughterOrFathersSistersDaughter is, and understanding and remembering "BiaoJie" would be much easier for me than re-parsing that every time. As I pointed out in another comment, there's a reason we give short names to complicated concepts instead of spelling them out every time. "while" is a lot easier to understand once its meaning has been explained to you than "EveryT…

BiaoJie is literally the transliteration of Chinese. So yes, naming it BiaoJie is saying this is explicitly Chinese.

Re: CNLabelContactRelation​YoungerCousin​MothersSiblingsDaughter​OrFathersSistersDaughter

#188

Post by toxik »

dang wrote: post #184
toxik wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really, you’re going to defend this lack of precision? I’m sure you can get by but having precise words is rarely a loss. Anglocentric superiority complex eh.

Please don't break the site guidelines by adding personal swipes to an argument. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

I disagree that calling out anglocentrism is a "personal swipe," it is relevant to the argument (i.e. that it is hard to see beyond your biases.) Discussion should surely not be stymied for the sake of civility, better we step on each other's toes and get our point across than sit in our respective corners and sulk.

I'm sure there was a better way to say what I said, but it was not mean-spirited as I am sure you can see.

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