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AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

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Re: AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

#181

Post by oliwarner »

mschuster91 wrote: post #166
oliwarner wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll start positively, by agreeing. Yes, if you can make a robot for $2k that does all that, cooks and cleans, perhaps teaches the kids to ride their bikes, dispenses oral sex, etc, again yes, they will sell and sell fast . But that's really a very significant distance from what we have, which is a constellation of very expensive robots that are demonstrably worse than humans at doing tasks unskilled humans are prett…

8$/h for vacuuming? No way unless you're abusing illegal immigrants.

Minimum wage for cleaners is standard here, but whether or not that tallies with your experience will probably depend on the cost of living where you are.

Re: AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

#182

Post by new299 »

JohnFen wrote: post #178
new299 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I can tell, based on the statistics I can find, you are somewhat of an outlier: https://www.bls.gov/TUS/CHARTS/HOUSEHOLD.HTM This data doesn’t break the statistics down by family size, but it still comes out at 2h a week for woman. The data includes all individuals older than 15. I suspect that the a average amount of time spend by families (particularly families with young children) would be much higher. P…

I must be an outlier as well. When my children were small, I was doing the laundry for the household. Two adults, two kids. I certainly wasn't spending more than an hour a week folding clothes. (My total time doing laundry was much higher, of course, particularly when the kids were diaper-age).

The parent comment seemed to suggest that they spent less than an hour was spent per week on all activities not including the clothes were in the washing machine. That’s what I was suggesting was low.

Re: AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

#183

Post by AstralStorm »

JohnFen wrote: post #162
AstralStorm wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Contrary to the name, softeners do not soften the fabric but water and add more ionic detergent plus some smell. You get a bit more efficient washing as long as you reduce amount of washing medium. Oh, and they do impart negative charge to the fabrics making them seem fluffier. Some softeners do have protective oil or silicone or polysorbate that will coat the fabric protecting it more. (Similar mechanism to hair rin…

> Some softeners do have protective oil or silicone or polysorbate that will coat the fabric I thought they all had that. I really dislike fabric softeners in part because I dislike the perfume they use and in part because they tend to render everything some degree of waterproof (bad for towels, particularly).

Not all of them do, cheap ones have the ionic detergent only and impart little benefit.

Re: AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

#184

Post by L_226 »

defterGoose wrote: post #169
L_226 wrote: post #63

I feel like folding clothes in an approximately rectangular shape is the wrong approach. Rolling clothes into cylinders is potentially easier to design for, and it is pretty effective for storage too.

I recently started using Marie Kondo's method and I was thinking the same thing. Some combination of rollers and a big ducted fan/tube to blow air into the shirt beforehand. Maybe we should have a go at it. What are you doing this Saturday? ;)

I'm flying to Italy (un)fortunately... But I am actually interested in exploring this if you are ever in Berlin.

Re: AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

#185

Post by Doxin »

JohnFen wrote: post #158
DanBC wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it turns out that washing machines didn't do much to save time. In the past people just didn't wash their clothes as often. Now people will wash their clothes after a single wear, and it's still mostly women who are doing the washing in families. https://twitter.com/TimHarford/status/1113123861602713600 https://twitter.com/DeconinckKoen/status/1054097445351776256

> But it turns out that washing machines didn't do much to save time. Maybe not, but it has saved lives. Doing laundry by hand was hardcore and caused quite a lot of physical damage to people, including deaths.

What, from people falling into the river and drowning? Seems like me that an electrical fire from a washing machine is about as likely.

Re: AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

#186

Post by netheril96 »

sytelus wrote: post #85

Folding arbitrary pile of laundry completely unsupervised is super hard problem. I actually have more faith in solving self-driving before that :). It seems company was Japanese, used loan model (as opposed to VC funding) and went bankrupt probably because creditors went after them. Their machine cost $16,000. The article describes scenario at CES where someone tried giving it black t-shirt but apparently machine cou…

> It also occurs to me that many people hang their cloth with hangers in closet instead of folding. Business proposition seems to be bit limited.

The logic does not follow in these two sentences. I hang my clothes instead of folding, because I am lazy. If a machine with a reasonable cost could do the folding for me, I would buy it, since folded clothes occupy much less space.

Re: AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

#187

Post by oliwarner »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #151
oliwarner wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agencies can insulate clients from that sort of junk. A small percentage over the base, tends to bring liability insurance with it, so it's usually worth it.

Then again, given the horror stories I've heard about such agencies (exploiting and abusing old people and immigrants), if you're a human being with a conscience, you now have to vet the agency, which is a non-trivial task.

No, I think this line of thinking is exceptionally counterproductive.

If you are the sort of lovely person who is bothered by others' working conditions and rights, a cleaner in your home is absolutely the best outcome. Not only do you get to pay above the odds —if you want to— you get to see them, you can talk to them and ask them how they're doing in life.

Conversely how do you suppose the teenagers who assembled your robot is being cared for? What about the miners extracting the rare earth metals used in batteries and motors? What about the villages around said mines that suffer horrific levels of pollution? And what about the dump where all this ends up in under 10 years time?

Re: AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

#188

Post by TeMPOraL »

oliwarner wrote: post #187
TeMPOraL wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then again, given the horror stories I've heard about such agencies (exploiting and abusing old people and immigrants), if you're a human being with a conscience, you now have to vet the agency, which is a non-trivial task.

No, I think this line of thinking is exceptionally counterproductive. If you are the sort of lovely person who is bothered by others' working conditions and rights, a cleaner in your home is absolutely the best outcome. Not only do you get to pay above the odds —if you want to— you get to see them, you can talk to them and ask them how they're doing in life. Conversely how do you suppose the teenagers who assembled y…

> Not only do you get to pay above the odds —if you want to— you get to see them, you can talk to them and ask them how they're doing in life.

To the extent that it makes this person's work bearable, it worsens the situation. The company abusing the worker gets to earn that much more money and stay in business that much longer. If everyone did that, such companies would worsen their treatment even more (this is the same phenomenon that makes jobs desirable for non-economic reasons pay less; satisfaction gets deducted from your salary).

> Conversely how do you suppose the teenagers who assembled your robot is being cared for? What about the miners extracting the rare earth metals used in batteries and motors? What about the villages around said mines that suffer horrific levels of pollution? And what about the dump where all this ends up in under 10 years time?

The way to help those people isn't to buy more of their products, ensuring they have more work to do.

Re: AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

#189

Post by JoeAltmaier »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #188
oliwarner wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I think this line of thinking is exceptionally counterproductive. If you are the sort of lovely person who is bothered by others' working conditions and rights, a cleaner in your home is absolutely the best outcome. Not only do you get to pay above the odds —if you want to— you get to see them, you can talk to them and ask them how they're doing in life. Conversely how do you suppose the teenagers who assembled y…

> Not only do you get to pay above the odds —if you want to— you get to see them, you can talk to them and ask them how they're doing in life. To the extent that it makes this person's work bearable, it worsens the situation. The company abusing the worker gets to earn that much more money and stay in business that much longer. If everyone did that, such companies would worsen their treatment even more (this is the s…

Agreed. But I worry about the 'first-world' convenience of this argument. Boycott abusive employers, maybe put them out of business! But the poor people working there are out of a job too. And they needed that job - it was miserable and yet they kept working, so I know they really needed it.

People have to eat every day. To lose a job, even a miserable one, is not something I want to inflict on somebody, especially sitting in my armchair in my comfortable house on 80 acres in the heartland of America.

So where does that leave my ambitions to be ethical in my buying?

Re: AI-powered laundry-folding robot company has filed for bankruptcy

#190

Post by [deleted] »

oliwarner wrote: post #187
TeMPOraL wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then again, given the horror stories I've heard about such agencies (exploiting and abusing old people and immigrants), if you're a human being with a conscience, you now have to vet the agency, which is a non-trivial task.

No, I think this line of thinking is exceptionally counterproductive. If you are the sort of lovely person who is bothered by others' working conditions and rights, a cleaner in your home is absolutely the best outcome. Not only do you get to pay above the odds —if you want to— you get to see them, you can talk to them and ask them how they're doing in life. Conversely how do you suppose the teenagers who assembled y…

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