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Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

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Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#181

Post by Gibbon1 »

gowld wrote: post #142
dsfyu404ed wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>One of the things that annoys me about this debate is that anti-semetic !== Anti Israel That's the point. People on the pro-Israel side of things know that being antisemitic is very much not acceptable for anyone in a position of power in the 1st world to be in this day any age so they try their hardest to conflate the two. It's much more obvious when the conflation is much more of a stretch, e.g. "how dare you not…

It works in reverse too, where you can dog-whistle any anti-Semitic statements by saying that you were refering to "Israeli government" or "globalists" or "bankers", not Jews.

My experience is out and out anti-Semites aren't into making subtle distinctions.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#182

Post by JadeNB »

isostatic wrote: post #179
JadeNB wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> few also call for boycotts of Turkey (invaded Cyprus in 1975), China (invaded Tibet in 1950), Russia (annexed Crimea in 2014 and parts of Georgia a few years earleir), UAE (occupied Socotra last year) I think that this statement is false in almost every case. (I hadn't heard about UAE, so don't have any perspective there.)

"boycott x", number of google results x = israel -- 616k x = china -- 57k x = saudi -- 50k x = russia -- 28k x = turkey -- 15k x = america -- 15k x = iran -- 11k x = korea -- 11k x = uae -- 10k x = britain -- 6k x = sudan -- 4k x = venezuela -- 2k

Sure, and this may be regarded as good first-approximation evidence of your initial claim, that criticism of Israel is disproportionate to criticism of other countries; but I don't think it is good evidence of the claim that few people call for boycotts of China, Russia, and Turkey, which was the specific claim to which I was responding.

Anyway, as far as using Google results to measure societal trends goes, "boycott Microsoft" yields 3.83m results, and I don't think it's fair to conclude that criticism of Microsoft is disproportionate compared to that of all the countries you listed.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#183

Post by chozenlarusso »

Dirlewanger wrote: post #152

You know what would start to stop all this? Getting pissed off at politicians for accepting essentially blank check amounts from AIPAC, who have been the largest lobbyist in Congress for decades. People don't want to talk about this though, because it's invariably labeled as "antisemitic".

And HN just turned into reddit.

The jews and their magic money, right?

AIPAC spent 3.5 million on lobbying in 2018. Do you have any idea how infinitesimal that is?

https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/clientsum.php?id=D00004696...

There was $5.7 billion dollars spent on lobbying during the mid term elections.

https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2019/02/cost-of-2018-electi...

In 2018, Google spent $21 million

https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/top.php?indexType=s&showYe...

The Healthcare industry spent $556 million

The Mexican government spent 2.3 million

https://www.opensecrets.org/fara/countries/87

But AIPAC is by far and away the real problem.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#184

Post by walrus01 »

_underfl0w_ wrote: post #167
walrus01 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How does one go about luring cybersecurity reaserchers? Given the overwhelmingly male demographic of people who describe themselves as "cybersecurity researchers", probably with $2000 escorts and hotel rooms rigged with cameras. It's not rocket science, literally one of the oldest espionage compromat tricks in the book.

Pretty sure escorts also come in the "male" variety. ...not that I would know...

Note that I didn't specify gender of the escort, either way is equally possible once a person's orientation has been identified.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#185

Post by Simon321 »

andreasley wrote: post #105
Simon321 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just that but they also seem linked to the Bezos incident! https://www.philly.com/opinion/commentary/jeff-bezos-nationa...

I think you are confusing them with "Blackwater". The article doesn't mention "Black Cube".

I mean NSO, not Black Cube.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#186

Post by isostatic »

JadeNB wrote: post #182
isostatic wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"boycott x", number of google results x = israel -- 616k x = china -- 57k x = saudi -- 50k x = russia -- 28k x = turkey -- 15k x = america -- 15k x = iran -- 11k x = korea -- 11k x = uae -- 10k x = britain -- 6k x = sudan -- 4k x = venezuela -- 2k

Sure, and this may be regarded as good first-approximation evidence of your initial claim, that criticism of Israel is disproportionate to criticism of other countries; but I don't think it is good evidence of the claim that few people call for boycotts of China, Russia, and Turkey, which was the specific claim to which I was responding. Anyway, as far as using Google results to measure societal trends goes, "boycott…

"boycott microsoft" is 11,200 [0]. apple 27k, google 20k, facebook 30k, twitter 15k, uber 13k.

Amazon is the only one that comes "close" - 98k -- 15% that of "boycott israel".

Boycotting Israel is an order of magnitude more than China, and 40 times that of Turkey, despite China doing far worse things over a constant period, and Russia and Turkey actually occupying developed countries

"Few" is obviously a relative term, and given that even China is less than 10% of Israel shows that Israel receives a disproportionate amount.

[0] http://imgur.com/s7wC8yTl.png

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#187

Post by [deleted] »

isostatic wrote: post #161
noir_lord wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the things that annoys me about this debate is that anti-semetic !== Anti Israel I've no issue with the Jews (I don't actually know any) but specific things the Israeli government does sure I do. Of course it's useful for people to conflate the two as they do with Corbyn or anyone who condemns Israel. Frankly I've no dog in the fight, I think Israel and the Palestinian's are frequently in the wrong. It's quite…

The problem with criticism of Israel is that it tends to be disproportionate compared with their criticism of other countries. While some call to boycott Israel due to it's illegal settlements in the west bank - an area it invaded in 1967, few also call for boycotts of Turkey (invaded Cyprus in 1975), China (invaded Tibet in 1950), Russia (annexed Crimea in 2014 and parts of Georgia a few years earleir), UAE (occupie…

[deleted]

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#188

Post by interfixus »

isostatic wrote: post #161
noir_lord wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the things that annoys me about this debate is that anti-semetic !== Anti Israel I've no issue with the Jews (I don't actually know any) but specific things the Israeli government does sure I do. Of course it's useful for people to conflate the two as they do with Corbyn or anyone who condemns Israel. Frankly I've no dog in the fight, I think Israel and the Palestinian's are frequently in the wrong. It's quite…

The problem with criticism of Israel is that it tends to be disproportionate compared with their criticism of other countries. While some call to boycott Israel due to it's illegal settlements in the west bank - an area it invaded in 1967, few also call for boycotts of Turkey (invaded Cyprus in 1975), China (invaded Tibet in 1950), Russia (annexed Crimea in 2014 and parts of Georgia a few years earleir), UAE (occupie…

> the west bank - an area it invaded in 1967

Or more specifically: an area it occupied in 1967 during a defensive war against an attacking coalition of neighbour states.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#189

Post by isostatic »

interfixus wrote: post #188
isostatic wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with criticism of Israel is that it tends to be disproportionate compared with their criticism of other countries. While some call to boycott Israel due to it's illegal settlements in the west bank - an area it invaded in 1967, few also call for boycotts of Turkey (invaded Cyprus in 1975), China (invaded Tibet in 1950), Russia (annexed Crimea in 2014 and parts of Georgia a few years earleir), UAE (occupie…

> the west bank - an area it invaded in 1967 Or more specifically: an area it occupied in 1967 during a defensive war against an attacking coalition of neighbour states.

Sure, it's not the first time Israel was attacked either.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#190

Post by gbrown »

lr4444lr wrote: post #180
gbrown wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a tiny minority of very unrepresentative Jews object to the modern state [Citation Needed] I think your comment is far more offensive than someone claiming they take issue with the actions of a nation state.

All denominations of Judaism aside from a few Haredi sects and maybe extreme secularists recognize the modern state of Israel as a legitimate country. Many adherents may not like how certain aspects of it are run, but they hold not anything remotely like what the totality of a position would entail to be "anti-Israel". The general acceptance of the country is about as common knowledge in Judaic studies as anything, a…

> denominations of Judaism

Which is mostly irrelevant, given the large and diverse groups of secular Jews worldwide. More importantly, you've moved the goalposts from having to defend a fairly extreme statement to trying to defend something like "Jews are more likely than average to support the modern state of Israel", which is just kind of obvious.

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