Seagate Announces 16TB HDD • Hacker News Board

Re: Seagate Announces 16TB HDD

#181

Post by Kye » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 4:28 AM UTC

baroffoos wrote: post #111

colinthompson wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My guess is that in terms of a time vs. money trade off, buying a new drive and shelving the old one is the preferred method of archiving. The maintenance required to convert all files to some compact format might be enough of a PITA (however minor), that it's simply more worth it to buy a new drive.

Would be good if the tools had an archive option that automatically saves all the files as flac and can decompress to wav again with a single button press.

Reaper's Save As dialog will let you collect all samples and convert them with the project file. I wish all DAWs had that.

Re: Seagate Announces 16TB HDD

#182

Post by 6nf » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 4:36 AM UTC

Thetawaves wrote: post #48

combatentropy wrote: post #2

From the article: "In a world where SSDs have become more and more common, one might ask what the point of even developing newer and bigger HDDs is." Solid state drives still cost about 10 times more per gigabyte. I'm just a web developer, but a spinning-disk drive looks 100 times more complicated to me to manufacture. I know at the beginning that hard drives would be cheaper, simply because SSDs were newer, and ther…

An added complication is that pure silicon in the required quantities is not cheap.

The amount of silicon we're talking about here is only a couple of cents per device

Re: Seagate Announces 16TB HDD

#183

Post by 6nf » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 4:40 AM UTC

iamgopal wrote: post #170

blattimwind wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but a spinning-disk drive looks 100 times more complicated to me to manufacture. Fun-fact: The "head fly height", i.e. the distance from the underside of the R/W head to the platter surface, is less than a handful nanometers in most hard drives; this makes the gap not just smaller than any production transistor, but also smaller than any production feature size.

How?

If two surfaces are flat enough and moving fast enough, the tiny amount of air (or helium these days) causes them to act hydrodynamically and float across each other which is great cause there's zero friction which means they never wear out.

The spindle in a hard drive is also an air bearing.

Re: Seagate Announces 16TB HDD

#184

Post by Aloha » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 4:52 AM UTC

notacoward wrote: post #134

As a professional storage-system developer, my reaction to every announcement of larger disks is something close to horror. Capacity keeps increasing while performance remains darn near constant, so the gap between the two keeps getting wider. Yes, we can use flash to absorb the I/O demand, treat disk more like tape, yadda yadda, but all of that takes significant effort. You do want your storage system to be correct…

The part that makes me recoil in horror is the potential damage wrought by one failure - at what point does the rebuild time for your RAID Array start to collide with the MTBF for the drives? ;-)

Re: Seagate Announces 16TB HDD

#185

Post by kevin_thibedeau » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 5:14 AM UTC

wtallis wrote: post #97

opencl wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole NAND industry is suspected to be engaging in price fixing/collusion[1]. They've already been caught doing it in the past and paid out a $300 million settlement over it back in 2006. [1] https://bit-tech.net/news/tech/memory/samsung-micron-sk-hyni...

That article is about DRAM, not NAND. Any article that talks about SK Hynix as a major player but doesn't mention Toshiba is clearly not about flash memory.

Sandisk and Toshiba have been investigated for price fixing.

Re: Seagate Announces 16TB HDD

#186

Post by aaronmdjones » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 5:54 AM UTC

mkirklions wrote: post #20

Anyone have an opinion about Seagate? I had one of their HDD and it died on me within a year. Not sure if this was a 'one-off' or other people had issues with their quality. Similar issue with samsung on SSD.

I've had 5 Seagates die on me, 4 of them all within 11 weeks of each other, all different models and capacities, 1 of them was a 2.5" laptop drive, 1 of them failed after being in use for 30 minutes. I told myself I'd never buy Seagate again, but when I had a drive failure in another laptop a few years ago... yep, it was that 5th Seagate; I didn't realise I had it.

I've had one Samsung HD502HJ failure -- my 3 other HD502HJs are still going. I haven't had any other drive failures. I have more than 30 drives, and some of them are more than 8 years old.

Re: Seagate Announces 16TB HDD

#187

Post by seattle_spring » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 6:07 AM UTC

ipsum2 wrote: post #135

ericd wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sibling comment is dead, but I second their recommendation of the Synology 1618+. It's been excellent in my experience. Even better when paired with a 10GbE NIC.

You can vouch for dead comments to un-dead them (bring it back to life?). I've done it for the sibling comment (by twothumbsup).

Not everyone can do that. I can flag submissions but not comments, and I can't vouch for anything. No idea why. Maybe my posts get flagged more often than I realize.

Re: Seagate Announces 16TB HDD

#188

Post by veridies » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 6:09 AM UTC

pmoriarty wrote: post #99

veridies wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I record and produce my own music as a hobby. Each project can easily reach gigabytes in size, and my biggest projects are eight gigabytes or so (eight drum mics, guitar, bass, vocals, and synthesizers, all uncompressed 24/96 audio, often with a number of different takes). I go through HDDs very quickly. I know that for development and most uses bigger HDDs are unnecessary, but for media production these improvements…

With that much data, I am curious as to how you do your backups. Do you backup off-site at all?

Not offsite, which I know I should. I use macOS, so I just have a Time Capsule set up with a giant HDD plugged into that for stuff I'm working on presently. Stuff I don't use actively I just make sure to put on two different HDDs in different places, and so I have two whole parallel sets of HDDs which I occasionally synchronize by hand. The whole system is very awkward, and I would be delighted if I really could rent reliable, trustworthy, offsite storage for a reasonable price.

Re: Seagate Announces 16TB HDD

#189

Post by veridies » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 6:10 AM UTC

randyrand wrote: post #64

veridies wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I record and produce my own music as a hobby. Each project can easily reach gigabytes in size, and my biggest projects are eight gigabytes or so (eight drum mics, guitar, bass, vocals, and synthesizers, all uncompressed 24/96 audio, often with a number of different takes). I go through HDDs very quickly. I know that for development and most uses bigger HDDs are unnecessary, but for media production these improvements…

Why not use FLAC? It gets 50-70% compression and is lossless.

Basically what everyone else said. DAWs all prefer uncompressed WAV or AIFF, and it takes quite a bit of time to convert back and forth to FLAC. Plus, even if I did that I'd still have to use external HDDs, just cheaper ones.

Re: Seagate Announces 16TB HDD

#190

Post by veridies » Thu, Dec 06, 2018, 6:14 AM UTC

soundwave106 wrote: post #109

randyrand wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not use FLAC? It gets 50-70% compression and is lossless.

Offhand I actually don't know of too many DAW programs that can record the individual tracks in FLAC format. Reaper does. Checking the Wiki ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_hardware_and_software_... ), it looks like Cakewalk Sonar does as well. But that leaves a lot of major players (Protools, Logic, Cubase, Ableton Live, FL Studio, etc.) that cannot. It's not something I personally would do because (as others…

And that's why when I use Omnisphere (which I love, BTW), I send my projects to my best friend's computer; there's no way in hell I could fit that on my computer's internal SSD.

Even the relatively small software instruments (I've been really into Soniccoture's Glass/Works, for instance) use up like 8 GB apiece.