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List of screw drives

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Re: List of screw drives

#181

Post by glenneroo »

mmillin wrote: post #135
magduf wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, they don't just seem to: Phillips was specifically designed to cam out. It was invented for this very purpose. When you're cursing with a Phillips screw that's stripped-out, you need to know that the fastener is doing exactly what it was designed to. The problem is people expecting these screws to be easily removable; that was never the intention. And the other problem is people using them for applications where…

The linked article says that there isn't a lot of evidence that was a deliberate design decision. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_screw_drives#Phillips

"There has long been a popular belief that this was actually a deliberate feature of the design, for the purpose of assembling aluminum aircraft without overtightening the fasteners. Extensive evidence is lacking for this specific narrative, and the feature is not mentioned in the original patents. However, a 1949 refinement to the original design described in US Patent #2,474,994 describes this feature."

Re: List of screw drives

#183

Post by jowsie »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #128
agumonkey wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Glue also fall in that case. It feels like a problem but more often than you know it's possible to unglue something. It just require different tools and knowledge.

What are the typical tools and methods to unglue stuff when fixing electronics?

Some phone makers are even kind enough to put removal tabs on the adhesive holding the battery in, so you can just heat it a tiny bit and pull on the tab to put a new battery in (still voids your warranty though).

Re: List of screw drives

#184

Post by miketuritzin »

Lionsion wrote: post #175

Important FYI for any Americans who don't know: Ikea screws are not Phillips, they're actually Pozidriv , which is different enough to matter. Do not use a Phillips screwdriver to assemble Ikea furnature, as that combination will easily cam out and ruin the (typically soft metal) screw. It's easiest to buy the correct Pozidriv screwdriver bits from Ikea, but they're also available online. My understanding is that Poz…

I found this out a few years ago after stripping several IKEA screws and getting incredibly frustrated. Bought a couple Pozidriv screwdrivers on Amazon, and they worked like a charm.

Re: List of screw drives

#185

Post by devy »

Lionsion wrote: post #175

Important FYI for any Americans who don't know: Ikea screws are not Phillips, they're actually Pozidriv , which is different enough to matter. Do not use a Phillips screwdriver to assemble Ikea furnature, as that combination will easily cam out and ruin the (typically soft metal) screw. It's easiest to buy the correct Pozidriv screwdriver bits from Ikea, but they're also available online. My understanding is that Poz…

IMMO, IKEA should switch to use square drive or torx drive to better eliminate the risk of cam-out. Pozidriv is more complex to manufacture (than Philips drive) but arguably less resistant to cam-out than sqaure drive (easier to manufacture too) or torx drive.

Re: List of screw drives

#186

Post by vertexFarm »

Lionsion wrote: post #175

Important FYI for any Americans who don't know: Ikea screws are not Phillips, they're actually Pozidriv , which is different enough to matter. Do not use a Phillips screwdriver to assemble Ikea furnature, as that combination will easily cam out and ruin the (typically soft metal) screw. It's easiest to buy the correct Pozidriv screwdriver bits from Ikea, but they're also available online. My understanding is that Poz…

Ugh, except Pozidriv will still cam and tear up their own screws, and same with Phillips. That's the secret to this tidbit of information that is never included. They're both trash fasteners when used with a slightly different driver, but they're also trash even when used correctly.

Robertson for life. When I was young I had a job assembling furniture and that, along with a couple Allen socket fasteners, was the only thing we used. Phillips fasteners that came with assemblies went straight into metal recycling to hopefully get born again as something worthwhile. You can practically drive a Robertson head straight through the center of the Earth with the amount of torque it handles. Never have to waste time drilling pilot holes.

If I was made dictator for a day, I'd immediately outlaw Phillips and Pozidriv. Even flat head is better than those pieces of junk.

There are a lot of Phillips fasteners that will also fit a Robertson bit. Just try both with the same screw. It's ludicrous how instantly you'll realize the Robertson is better.

Re: List of screw drives

#187

Post by devy »

mikepurvis wrote: post #164
nfriedly wrote: post #131

When my wife and I bought our house, I thought the previous owner had stripped the hell out of some Phillips screws... then I learned what Robertson (square) screws were. After getting the proper bit though, I’ve started to really appreciate them. I don’t think I’ve ever stripped a single one.

Robertson is excellent but they seem to be a uniquely Canadian phenomenon. My company ships robots to the US in big crates, and we've had to switch to building them with Philips screws instead because of issues with local availability.

Robertson (Square) drive are also gaining popularity in building decking applications in the U.S. I've seen quite a few options in Home Depot / Lowes stores in the Northeast. One of reasons they are less popular than Philips is the price as square drives are a little bit more expensive and tend to be offered at premium brand screws.

Re: List of screw drives

#188

Post by devy »

vertexFarm wrote: post #186
Lionsion wrote: post #175

Important FYI for any Americans who don't know: Ikea screws are not Phillips, they're actually Pozidriv , which is different enough to matter. Do not use a Phillips screwdriver to assemble Ikea furnature, as that combination will easily cam out and ruin the (typically soft metal) screw. It's easiest to buy the correct Pozidriv screwdriver bits from Ikea, but they're also available online. My understanding is that Poz…

Ugh, except Pozidriv will still cam and tear up their own screws, and same with Phillips. That's the secret to this tidbit of information that is never included. They're both trash fasteners when used with a slightly different driver, but they're also trash even when used correctly. Robertson for life. When I was young I had a job assembling furniture and that, along with a couple Allen socket fasteners, was the only…

> Even flat head is better than those pieces of junk.

I would argue that flat head is the worst. They are not designed to be used with power tools.

Re: List of screw drives

#189

Post by simonbarker87 »

nsxwolf wrote: post #179
Lionsion wrote: post #175

Important FYI for any Americans who don't know: Ikea screws are not Phillips, they're actually Pozidriv , which is different enough to matter. Do not use a Phillips screwdriver to assemble Ikea furnature, as that combination will easily cam out and ruin the (typically soft metal) screw. It's easiest to buy the correct Pozidriv screwdriver bits from Ikea, but they're also available online. My understanding is that Poz…

Amazing that this has never met my attention. Why doesn't IKEA make this more clear?

Probably because there are little marks on the top of each pozidrive screws that indicate it is different. The don’t explain it in Europe either, it’s just a thing you should notice and account for when building stuff. I would put identifying pozidrive vs Phillips in the same camp as just knowing how to use a screw driver but perhaps I’m being harsh

Re: List of screw drives

#190

Post by vertexFarm »

devy wrote: post #188
vertexFarm wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ugh, except Pozidriv will still cam and tear up their own screws, and same with Phillips. That's the secret to this tidbit of information that is never included. They're both trash fasteners when used with a slightly different driver, but they're also trash even when used correctly. Robertson for life. When I was young I had a job assembling furniture and that, along with a couple Allen socket fasteners, was the only…

> Even flat head is better than those pieces of junk. I would argue that flat head is the worst. They are not designed to be used with power tools.

Phillips isn't properly designed for power or hand tools. If it strips with a screwdriver, it's definitely going to strip with a drill. I've rarely seen power-driven Phillips screws that didn't have some sign of stripping, even using torque limiters and even on things fresh from the factory.

At least flat head takes uneven torque from hand tools well. It also allows improvised tools to be used in the field. If I'm working on say an off-road vehicle like a dirt bike, I'm going to tend to use just one size of hex bolt (usually 10mm) and flat heads for the screws.

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